Video Poker Forum

I have had several nice emails with Allen Vermeulen, Director of Slots at the new Golden Nugget Lake Charles and I really appreciate his quick response.   I commend Mr. Vermeulen and thank him for his responses. Over the next few months I will continue to share/update the GNLC situation.

I shared with him the following concerns about the VP at Golden Nugget Lake Charles and have added his response in color:

Lower Pay Tables:
·    Coushatta and IOC/LC are in the 99% return range for all denominations of Video Poker.

·    GN is in the 97% even in the $1 denomination.

·    This makes a huge impact on heavy VP player’s decisions.

AV: I frequently visit VPfree and videopoker.com. I use them for partial analysis. I shopped the competition (except for Delta but I am fairly familiar with Boyd’s philosophy and strategy)before we opened but, haven’t had a lot of time to do so since opening. It is one of the things high on my priority list. I felt our offering was in line with the market and referred to the vendor for recommendations as well (I’ll never claim to be the poker guru).

Limited Machine Options:
·    GN has only 2 -100-play machines. We love the denomination options but usually can’t get to a 100-play machine. Coushatta has six (6) 50/100-hand machines. Please add some additional 50/100 multi-denomination/multi-hand machines.

AV:We do have spin poker available at Bar 46 and I am working on additional 100 play games. I wish I had a more definitive time frame to offer but, I am still in the early phases of wrapping this up with the vendor. As we get closer I will let Justin (our host) know.

·    All Star Machines with limited game selections (All Star machines have eight game options at multiple denominations) Please change your load set to allow all eight core All Star games at multi-denominations to be available.

AV: All Star poker was set like it is because we didn’t have the full setting sheet while we were testing with the state police so rather than not have them for opening I used what was available.

·    Spin Poker – we’ve only found 1 machine. Please expand this option at multiple denominations. Expanding the All Star machines would help since this is a basic AS game option.

·    Popular games (Bonus DW, DW Dbl Bonus are not generally available). These are popular games in the LC area.


Inability to play Cash Back/Weekly Rewards $ on VP machines Limited Game Options:
·    Coushatta and Isle both allow us to play our CB/Weekly $ on VP machines. This is an important issue for VP players as it makes up for some of the extra coin-in we have to play to earn points. Please give us the option to play these monies on VP machines.

AV: I generally shy away from free play discussions because I understand both sides.


Many of us have issues or concerns with/at the casinos we play. As I frequently told my parents at school, if you don't tell my you have an issue I probably wont know about it and can't work to fix it.

I have generally found that communicating directly with the Directors of Slots, Marketing and my casino host usually gets a response since they are truly interested in hearing from patrons. For example, recently at Coushatta our favorite machines had the old "knee knockers" coin trays. They were basically only good for collecting ashes, spilled drinks, and killing our knees during hours of play. Over several trips I made it a point to mention our discomfort to several slot shift managers and suits who were on the floor. I was always polite and explained how it impacted our play. Several weeks later one of the young slot managers recognized me as I approached the machines and told me that the issue of removing the trays had been discussed during their weekly meeting. As we both reached my favorite machines, we were both delighted to see they had been removed during the night shift.   A day later I received an email from the Director of Slots informing me they had been removed as a result of my multiple requests. He indicated the issue had not been brought to their attention until I started my requests.

I applaud your initiative to write such a through letter of concerns to the Director at Golden Nugget with regards to the situation. I hope more can follow your example to at least spark a little hope of improving the condition of VP play, though casinos have the ultimate say on the amount of income they need to bring in to cover operational expenses and state required revenues.

At least you've received a professional response and not something along the lines of "if you do not like it, do not play" attitude. Hopefully they show that they will do something about it and not just talk the talk.

Kudos to you and thanks for sharing!

I didn't read this super closely, but I feel like he gave you a "brushoff response".

Hopefully I'm wrong.

Good job Larry   Keep up the good workIf and when the Golden Nugget gets more in line with Chousatta's pay-tables and comps, then I will return.

[QUOTE=Lucky Larry] I have had several nice emails with Allen Vermeulen, Director of Slots at the new Golden Nugget Lake Charles and I really appreciate his quick response.   I commend Mr. Vermeulen and thank him for his responses. Over the next few months I will continue to share/update the GNLC situation.

I shared with him the following concerns about the VP at Golden Nugget Lake Charles and have added his response in color:


AV: I frequently visit VPfree and videopoker.com. I use them for partial analysis. I shopped the competition (except for Delta but I am fairly familiar with Boyd’s philosophy and strategy)before we opened but, haven’t had a lot of time to do so since opening. It is one of the things high on my priority list. I felt our offering was in line with the market and referred to the vendor for recommendations as well (I’ll never claim to be the poker guru).

I found this particular reply from Mr. Vermeulen to be interesting.
He frequently visits VPfree and videopoker.com for partial analysis?   Id love to know what he's learning by reading VP forums?
He must not be learning very much from them, seeing he's offering 97% games when his competition is offering 99% games. .And with so many players on vpfree and videopoker.com rightfully complaining about the state of VP pay tables these days , he obviously not paying much attention to what is being said in those forums.

And when your title is director of slots, don't you think it might be a good idea to become at least some what of a   "poker guru"?


I commend you Larry for writing to him, and look forward to seeing how it plays out.

Not all casinos choose to compete with video poker pay schedulesIn Las Vegas, for example, the Strip casinos typically have worse pay schedules at low denominations than do the Vegas local casinos. But they have nicer restaurants, night clubs, hotel rooms, ambiance, etc.I've never scouted Lake Charles --- but from reading the GN website, the fact that they have an 18-hole championship golf course and are the newest, nicest casino in the area would mean to me that they should not be trying to match the lesser-properties pay schedules. Each casino needs to pick it's battles, because they can't win them all.Also keep in mind that GN is part of a chain and they have a corporate vice president of slots who sets the overall tone of the pay schedules. The local slot director only has "so much" latitude in making "loosening" decisions.Kudos to LL for beginning the discussion with the slot director and sharing it with us. Clearly the slot director hasn't scouted the area completely recently. Perhaps Larry can get a "consulting" job making a report. But the report will have to be a lot more comprehensive than just the few games and denominations LL personally plays.I started out making such reports "as a courtesy," and several led to paying gigs, should LL be interested in this. It does require him to see the entire picture from the casino's point of view rather than just a "loosen them all up 'cause I want a better deal" philosophy. Remember, the reason a casino should loosen machines is not because they are "nice guys." The reason for them to loosen machines is because THEY can make more money doing so. Sometimes this is the case --- and sometimes it isn't. They have to evaluate who they want their core customers to be, and perhaps those customers want better food, rooms, and ambiance rather than looser pay schedules. I would assume the LC population as a whole is a lot less savvy about
video poker pay schedules than the local Las Vegas population is, so any
slot director who make LC pay schedules as loose as Vegas local pay
schedules is costing his owner money and should probably be fired.Also, it's probably fair to say that a large part of the LC casino traffic is bus traffic from Texas. If and when Texas legalizes casinos, the casinos in LC will definitely have to loosen up to compete. Until then, not so much.Bob

This is not about Golden Nugget, but I think the body of my post is pertinent. I have been in touch with and met on quite a few occasions the Director of Player Development ( new title Director of Relationship Marketing ) at Mohegan Sun over the last few years. I suggested he use my play as an example of what it takes to keep a player, have them stay and play longer, and probably make more money for the casino. I wish it weren't the case, but it is.
     A few years ago I noticed vp machines with better paytables start to disappear at Mohegan Sun and Foxwoods too. Foxwoods hasn't stopped doing this, but for now Mohegan Sun pretty much has and in fact added some more good ones. They still offer many many machines with 99.54 returns and many others in the 98.5-99.5 range. They start at the quarter level to and even a few nickel ones thrown in.
     I told the director Foxwoods had lost 99% of my business, my frequency of trips nearly doubles, as did my losses therefore profit for the casino. I suggested it would be easy for their staff to track other vp players as well to see the pattern. The big mistake they made though IMO is not awarding player points on good paytable vp machines. I know they think that will cost them too much money, but since you have to cycle through nearly 500 bucks to get just 1 point worth 1 dollar to spend at the casino, I think they are still being a little short sided. That is up to them to figure out someday. On an average day at the casino, I used to earn at that rate, only about 20 points per trip which only cost them gas money to get me there and back. I would usually leave them with anywhere between 200 and 1200 bucks of my money on about 9 out of 10 trips or more. Many vp players either quit playing vp at Mohegan Sun because of this or play elsewhere. I am sure their losses would be in the ballpark of mine for a long session if not more. I just don't get it, but at least for now they listened to me and are keeping the good paytables. Hope I didn't jinx that too.

Just edited to add...helps that the director and I have one of the same hobbies...old cars and trucks...easier to talk that way about things.

[ He frequently visits VPfree and videopoker.com for partial analysis?   Id love to know what he's learning by reading VP forums?
 
If he looks at the jackpot pictures here, he'll see that there is no need to loosen pay schedules because a large proportion of the posters on this site will play any pay schedule at all.He can see how often Lake Charles is mentioned in the posts on these sites (i.e. not very). If he wants to see how knowledgeable the players as a whole are, he'll find the posters (as a whole) on vpFREE are much more serious players than the posters here. There are relatively few professional players who post here. There are several over there. The previous paragraph is not meant to imply which forum is "better." They both have their core audience and different players find one a better fit for them than the other. If you poll the members here, I suspect most would say they prefer this site to vpFREE. If you poll the members of vpFREE, you'll get the opposite result.But if the slot director wished to make an announcement to the video poker community about some upcoming promotion or a change in machines, (using a handle such as SUZYSLOTS or CRAZY-FOR-VP or something else that wouldn't identify him), where he would choose to post would depend upon which players he hoped to attract. Any slot director who does not do something like this, or have someone on his staff do something like this, is probably not very good at his job.

Some players here post pictures of jackpots and yes; these pictures may reveal less than stellar pay schedules. These same players may be geographically limited to playing the pay schedules at the casinos for which they can get to. I consider myself to be a casual player and I, for one, do play machines with pay schedules that may be passed over by the more "professional" players.

if i wanted to put 10 gallons of gas in my car and i could save twenty cents a gallon by traveling 20 minutes away, would it be worth it? if i was filing up a tanker truck, of course it would be. that is how i look at VP, as a recreational player, i need to weigh the overall costs versus the rewards. i respect mr. dancer's and others data, but if i have to pay $400 to go someplace, get less free play, just to get better paytables, i am not sure it is worth it. if you are playing a lot, like the tanker truck, it probably is worth the added expense.    i have visited other VP sites, that apparently have more sophisticated players, but most of the honest posters, still admit to losing.