Video Poker Forum

OTABILL wrote: ↑

Fri Aug 21, 2020 8:26 pm

There is one in Bob's 9/6 DDB chart like that. # 37 which says to hold the FL3 ih KTx before just the RF KT, QT. Why just the KTX and not the QTX?

For those unfamiliar with my notation, 'KTx' refers to a king ten with another suited card that is far enough away from the 'KT' that it's not part of a 3-card straight flush or 3-card royal flush draw. Specifically, this means 'KT2' - 'KT8'

'QTx' would mean 'QT2' - 'QT7'

The simplest answer to OTABILL's question is 'QT' is considerably more valuable than 'KT', because of additional straights and straight flushes it's part of. 'QT' is much better than 'QTx' in this game. The only games I know of where 'QTx' is held are games where flushes return 7-for-1, and also 9/6 DDB Ultimate X where you get such a big multiplier for connecting on a flush that you go for it more.

'KT' is barely eligible to be held in most games (just as 'AT' is barely ineligible to be held in most games.) The correct play to 'KTx' can be one, two, or three cards. In versions of Deuces Wild where flushes pay 2-for-1, usually you hold zero cards.

BobDancer wrote: ↑

Fri Aug 21, 2020 10:15 pm

OTABILL wrote: ↑

Fri Aug 21, 2020 8:26 pm

There is one in Bob's 9/6 DDB chart like that. # 37 which says to hold the FL3 ih KTx before just the RF KT, QT. Why just the KTX and not the QTX?

For those unfamiliar with my notation, 'KTx' refers to a king ten with another suited card that is far enough away from the 'KT' that it's not part of a 3-card straight flush or 3-card royal flush draw. Specifically, this means 'KT2' - 'KT8'

'QTx' would mean 'QT2' - 'QT7'

The simplest answer to OTABILL's question is 'QT' is considerably more valuable than 'KT', because of additional straights and straight flushes it's part of. 'QT' is much better than 'QTx' in this game. The only games I know of where 'QTx' is held are games where flushes return 7-for-1, and also 9/6 DDB Ultimate X where you get such a big multiplier for connecting on a flush that you go for it more.

'KT' is barely eligible to be held in most games (just as 'AT' is barely ineligible to be held in most games.) The correct play to 'KTx' can be one, two, or three cards. In versions of Deuces Wild where flushes pay 2-for-1, usually you hold zero cards.

Thanks Bob. It is a subtlety not easily discerned, at least by me.

I remember that as it's the same for 10/6 DDB.

Jstark wrote: ↑

Sat Aug 22, 2020 11:11 am

I remember that as it's the same for 10/6 DDB.

Actually, it's not. Whether you get 200 or 250 for the straight flush, from 'KTx' you hold 'KT' UNLESS there is an off-suit 9 in the hand, in which case you hold 'KTx'

The reason the strategy changes for 10/6 is full houses are worth more and it's possible to draw a full house holding 'KT' and impossible holding 'KTx'

The reason the presence of the 9 affects things is that it lowers the chances of getting the KQJT9 straight when you just hold 'KT'. It's not a big effect, but enough to change the correct play.

Agreed Bob. I was just making a generalization as the play is utilized in that game. I guess I should have been more precise in my post. And it was the 200 straight flush version.

I love the analysis it’s really helpful

OTABILL wrote: ↑

Fri Aug 21, 2020 8:26 pm

There is one in Bob's 9/6 DDB chart like that. # 37 which says to hold the FL3 ih KTx before just the RF KT, QT. Why just the KTX and not the QTX?

Holding suited KT vs QT is a weaker hold, given the fewer straight possibilities on the draw. The value of suited KTx lies between these two.

Everyone learns differently.

When I first started playing VP, I used strategy cards that detailed simple and intermediate strategies.

As software and apps get better, it helps to learn the expected value of each hand and why one hold is better than the other. And of course, practice is invaluable. If you don't think analytically why it's better to hold certain hands over others, you won't do very well learning strategies for new or different games that might interest you in the future.

Once you get pretty close to playing perfect strategy, it helps to carry a book like the pocket sized reference by Chris Newman entitled "The Ultimate Video Poker Book." It ranks each hand by expected value for many popular variants with the best several paytables. I keep it with me most of the time as it's real handy to decide between difficult hands that are separated by just a few hundredths or thousandths of a percentage point in ev.