No Royal Flush Strategy DDB

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parnellllll
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No Royal Flush Strategy DDB

Post by parnellllll »

Does a strategy exist in DDB to exclude a Royal Flush? I sometimes play DDB for 1 coin at higher denominations because I can still hit 4 of a kinds. But was thinking I would get a better overall payback with a No Royal Strategy? Is this correct thinking or is a no bonus Royal still worth playing for?

dinghy
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Post by dinghy »

parnellllll wrote:
Mon Jan 18, 2021 8:39 am
Does a strategy exist in DDB to exclude a Royal Flush? I sometimes play DDB for 1 coin at higher denominations because I can still hit 4 of a kinds.
A strategy calculator/generator will allow you to adjust the royal flush value. On the Wizard of Odds calculator for example, you would reduce the royal from 800 (per coin) to 250 (most commonly).

Consider a decision such as three to a royal with an accompanying fourth flush card. Betting max, you'd go for the royal usually. Betting short, you'd go for the flush.

parnellllll
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Post by parnellllll »

Thanks for quick reply dinghy! Been on Wizard a bunch of times didn't realize it actually generates strategy when you plug in #'s, what a site!! If I am plugging things in correctly I believe you gain almost 1% by playing a no RF strategy (.9783 vs .9702)

olds442jetaway
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Post by olds442jetaway »

If you ever make it to Mohegan Sun in Ct, I can show you where there is a lone quarter machine that pays 800 for bet one, and a lone dollar one that pays 800 for bet one. The dollar one is currently shut down due to covid spacing. Believe it or not, there are some 800 for bet one nickel ones too on spin poker games. There is a big downside on the nickel games. I think those are 7/5 on the DDB game. That brings the total return to a pitiful 95.7%

dinghy
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Post by dinghy »

parnellllll wrote:
Mon Jan 18, 2021 11:03 am
If I am plugging things in correctly I believe you gain almost 1% by playing a no RF strategy (.9783 vs .9702)
I think we should be speaking in terms of a "reduced RF" strategy because the RF can't pay zero. It pays either 800 or 250.

Roughly, the standard royal contributes 2% of 99% total (assuming 9/6 DDB).

The reduced royal represents a 1.4% penalty, suggesting an EV of 97.6%.

Strategy adjustments appear to add 0.2%, which gets us above 97.8% as you mentioned.

olds442jetaway
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Post by olds442jetaway »

Over time, unless one is playing strictly for recreation, a 97.8 total return will beat you up pretty bad over time. For someone like myself who runs 2,000,000 coin in a year through vp machines, playing that way with perfect play would cost me long term 44,000 every year as supposed to 9/6 JOB that will cost me without incentives 9,200 a year long term.
Playing for fun and cycling say 1,000 a session through the machine long term would cost just 22 bucks a session

dinghy
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Post by dinghy »

olds442jetaway wrote:
Mon Jan 18, 2021 10:52 pm
Over time, unless one is playing strictly for recreation, a 97.8 total return will beat you up pretty bad over time.
If you give up EV, it's important to be rewarded for it. Three ways to give up EV at video poker:

(1) Choose a lesser pay table
(2) Play incorrect strategy
(3) Bet less than maximum

In my experience, only #1 is likely to improve your slot club benefits. The problem with #3 is you're converting a good game into a bad game, but the casino still thinks you're playing a good game.

I hope that makes sense.

parnellllll
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Post by parnellllll »

Probably should have presented my question this way to begin. Choice play 9/5 JOB(.25 max bet) vs 9/6 DDB($1 level for 1 coin). I will be playing 25k through a year, so not even a full RF cycle. Dinghy do i have my #'s right 9/5 JOB 98.45%, 9/6 DDB w/short pay strategy 97.8%. I know a quick look says JOB but the payout includes RF without that it is down to approx 96.45%. Where i feel the 97.8% is more likely because it does not depend on a RF as much???

Waiting4RF
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Post by Waiting4RF »

In DDB you need to get the Aces with kicker too. That "cycle" is about 16,000 hands. So you need to hit about 1.5 of those in 25,000 hands to get the EV. You may get 0, 1, or more quad aces with kicker. But not 1.5

dinghy
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Post by dinghy »

parnellllll wrote:
Tue Jan 19, 2021 12:43 pm
Choice play 9/5 JOB(.25 max bet) vs 9/6 DDB($1 level for 1 coin). I will be playing 25k through a year, so not even a full RF cycle.
In that case I would play the JOB. Or I wouldn't play at all.

JOB has a variance of 19.5.

DDB 1-coin variance is 27.5.

Variance is not a perfect measurement, but it suggests the DDB will be more volatile. And I think you can see it in the probabilities if you look at the difficulty of hitting premium quads.

If you choose the DDB, you're reducing EV and increasing volatility -- a bad combination.

On the other hand, if DDB is more fun for you, maybe it's worthwhile despite the drawbacks.

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