How exactly are video poker machines rigged?

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tboarder10
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How exactly are video poker machines rigged?

Post by tboarder10 »

Hi, I'm new to the forum but I've been playing video poker for quite a while and one thing that's obvious to me is that these machines are not "random." That is, the cards you get are not simple mathematical probabilities. Machines can be loosened, but most times they're tightened to an extreme degree, and that doesn't mean that the pay tables are 99.4% instead of 100.76%, it means that a given machine, if the casino wants, can be rigged to not let you hit any big hands, to give you virtually no deuces on Deuces Wild, or any number of other things that make the actual real-life pay table 0% for the duration that the machine is rigged. These 0% machines appear to be the majority now at most casinos.

I'm not really interested in debating whether or not this is true, because I realize it's controversial and none of us have long-term statistical data to prove our claims, so we just rely on some regulatory agency to do it for us, because as we know from other facets of American life, regulatory agencies are totally never in the pockets of the companies they regulate.

What I am curious about is how the machines are actually modified by the casino, because as far as I can tell, a machine can be good one day and terrible the next day. It's not like they're shipped out with tight or loose settings, so that means there's some kind of setting within the program itself (which is likely manufactured by IGT) that can be tweaked. But wouldn't that mean a slot mechanic or somebody has to come over and change the setting manually? Are these machines even connected to the internet? Maybe it's naive to think, but the design looks so old that it gives off the appearance that there's no modern technology going on here.

However, I was looking at IGT's website the other day and came across this: https://www.igt.com/products-and-servic ... management

They talk about a management software that lets the casino manage...something. You need some kind of account in order to look at more information but I think we can probably all guess. Probably some kind of centralized command center where they can change how a machine is acting remotly. I personally think there's at least some automated settings that trigger certain changes in response to the hands you get. Like if a machine is very tight and you hit a deuces royal or something, then often on the next ten hands you get literally nothing, like not even a pair. That has to be programmed in. If it's a looser machine then it will just play normally even after you hit something big, and you have a real chance to keep doing well. It doesn't require that you give back whatever you just won like the tight machines do.

And just to be absolutely clear, I'm not looking for any information that can help me cheat or anything like that. It's actually the casino that's cheating according to the letter of the law, I'm just trying to figure out how. I'd love to hear any insight that anyone can offer and I'm open to any opinions.

dinghy
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Post by dinghy »

tboarder10 wrote:
Thu Mar 30, 2023 6:44 am
These 0% machines appear to be the majority now at most casinos.
Where are you playing? From context, I'll guess Nevada.

onemoretry
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Post by onemoretry »

tboarder10 wrote:
Thu Mar 30, 2023 6:44 am
I'm not really interested in debating whether or not this is true, because I realize it's controversial and none of us have long-term statistical data to prove our claims, ....
To paraphrase: "Despite having no evidence at all, I've made up my mind, and nothing can change it".

wildman49
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Post by wildman49 »

Everyone has there own idea of what's going on with these new machines. They are very sophisticated computers and none of the companys like Bally, IGT and others are going to give out there secrets.

I just try to read between the lines of these articles to make up my own mine.

Server-based gaming is revolutionising slot floors all over the world and has captured the imagination of the big slot manufacturers. Simon Binns takes a closer look...

[urlhttps://www.intergameonline.com/casino/features ... hat-counts][/url]

The two broad types of functionality used in WAGE-NET are remote configuration and asset download. Remote configuration refers the ability to dynamically change the denomination, line count, or theoretical hold percentage of the game, based on the regulatory approved idle time between changes that is mandated.

Videobet’s range of downloadable content is supported by multiple RNG and system configurations and the company has developed live game video broadcasting and a real-time back office allowing full control over each terminal.

wildman49
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Post by wildman49 »

I know one will say that's only for slots not VP. Once again this morning I sat at the next gen VP machine, put my wife's free play in played 10 nickels. I cashed out after 10 hands never got a nickel on 9/6 JOB. These new machines play like a slot machine.

yes, a 95-percent payback machine can become a 90-percent game in seconds.

Players don't know through any of this if the payback percentage is being changed, if it's moving up or down, or what the payback percentage is at all. But then again, we never have been able to tell by looking at a game whether it's a red-hot 99-percent game or a coin gobbling 85-percenter. We don't know what's on the chips inside each game on the floor now any more than we'll know what payback percentage has been selected from the menu on a server-based game.


https://www.casinocitytimes.com/john-gr ... ames-26734

Eduardo
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Post by Eduardo »

I'm curious why you think "theoretical hold percentage" would be referring to anything but the pay table, which is quite visible to the player in video poker.

dinghy
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Post by dinghy »

wildman49 wrote:
Thu Mar 30, 2023 1:32 pm
multiple RNG
I interpret it as one RNG being available to multiple games, rather than any one game having access to multiple RNGs. But I don't understand all the jargon.
wildman49 wrote:
Thu Mar 30, 2023 1:52 pm
I know one will say that's only for slots not VP.
Although I lean toward the "VP is fair" viewpoint, I'm not totally comfortable with the blurred boundaries between slots and VP. I know there's a regulatory rule requiring the deck of cards to be fair, but I'm less confident of gimmicks such as spinning wheels (Wheel Poker) or flickering multipliers (Super Times Pay).

tech58
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Post by tech58 »

Eduardo wrote:
Thu Mar 30, 2023 3:28 pm
I'm curious why you think "theoretical hold percentage" would be referring to anything but the pay table, which is quite visible to the player in video poker.
Not to try to give an answer for Wildman. He would be pissed, he knows how to find me , and he is bigger than I am. :ouch:

However, pressing on anyway, in my opinion your question would be totally correct, in it's inference, only if the results of each hand were completely random.

As we all know the pay-table is visible. But the RNG and deck composition is unknown.
Are they accessible and alterable by the machine owner? Certainly illegal, extremely unlikely in regulated venues, but an open question for un-regulated Indian casinos. Stating AGAIN my position on this open question: I have no evidence nor suspicion of any illegal activities by ANY casino. I am only a pilgrim on a search for knowledge. Is the randomness alterable or not?

Most of the links in this thread refer to slots where games, pay-back % min. coin-in etc. are legally variable within limits.
The casino owner can do as he wishes with those poor lost souls.

dinghy
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Post by dinghy »

tech58 wrote:
Fri Mar 31, 2023 11:59 am
extremely unlikely in regulated venues
The OP is alleging the opposite, if I'm interpreting correctly. And others have recently questioned the fairness of Nevada games.

How extensively have you played in Nevada?

tech58
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Post by tech58 »

dinghy wrote:
Fri Mar 31, 2023 12:43 pm
tech58 wrote:
Fri Mar 31, 2023 11:59 am
extremely unlikely in regulated venues
The OP is alleging the opposite, if I'm interpreting correctly. And others have recently questioned the fairness of Nevada games.

How extensively have you played in Nevada?
Nowhere near enough to question their opinion. Once or twice a year for 50 years. But most of that on 21.
Only !5 years on VP.
I stand corrected and yield the floor.

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