Wheel Poker w/Quick Quads for Southpoint Players
Posted: Wed Jun 28, 2017 8:11 pm
There has been some interest in Wheel Poker with Quick Quads by PPP in the past and most recently by billryan on the Triple Wheel Poker Insight thread. Thus, it will be an insight worth exploring on the 9/6 Jacks or Better Wheel Poker w/ Quick Quads. The same technique can be applied to other game variants Bonus Poker and Double Bonus which offers slightly less return to the player on the Quick Quads but slightly more return with both Wheel Poker and Quick Quads enabled.
Disclaimer: The Southpoint Casino is one of very few casinos to have Wheel Poker with Quick Quads available for real money wagers. Hence this will be only useful for players who are able to play there as a local or have plans to visit there as a non-local.
“The Southpoint Casino has more than 10,000 video poker games returning over 99%, that is more than anyone else has.†A quote from Mr. Dancer during GWAE commercial breaks, as the Southpoint is one of the main sponsors of the show. I might have also seen a billboard as well.
Wheel Poker w/Quick Quads is one of the games that fit that description. As one of the top video poker casinos in the nation, I would presume that they also have the top skilled players as well. Upon initial glance at the strategy, I am convinced that It will take a highly skilled player or someone who has completed Mr. Dancer’s video poker seminar to take on this game.
What is this game Wheel Poker w/Quick Quads (WPwQQ)?
The title of the game says it all, it combines the elements of two specialty games, Wheel Poker and Quick Quads. Quick Quads is a game that allows players to achieve quads 2.6 times easier with adjusted strategy approach for an additional credit wager, from having a 5-card result of trips and the other two cards adding up in rank matching the rank of the trips (e.g. 9h-9s-9c-6c-3d, 6 + 3 = 9). Wheel Poker offers bonus credit amounts to the player if they hit a quad for an additional credit wager. These two complement each other very nicely, but I will not know the backstory of the rarity of this game.
The Wheel Poker w/Quick Quads is one of the few remaining games that offers flexible wagers to the player.
Take for example this Triple Play setting. Press the Bet One carefully to set up the wager.
At Bet 15 Credits, you will have a multiline 9/6 Jacks or Better game
At Bet 18 Credits, you will have a multiline 9/6 Jacks or Better with Quick Quads enabled. The notable change is that the Four of a Kind pays 236 credits. The 9/6 Jacks or Better normal Quick Quads on videopoker.com pays 235 credits.
This alone (from 236 to 235) lowers the payout to 99.507% (strategy is less aggressive towards quads) and will be inaccurate to practice should the Player only want to do just the QQ.
At Bet 21 Credits or with a single push of the Bet MAX button, the player has both Quick Quads and Wheel Poker
The Game Returns for each feature
The standard 9/6 Jacks or Better returns 99.544% to the player with optimal plays. An outstanding offer I would take.
The 9/6 Jacks or Better with Quick Quads returns 99.609%, a few hundredth percent more return, but with the necessary strategy adjustments (more on that later).
The full Wheel Poker and Quick Quads returns 99.617%, a few thousandth percent more return, but with more strategy adjustments than the Quick Quad standalone.
Resources Available for 9/6 Jacks or Better Quick Quads
PDF book – A Quick Guide to Quick Quads by Bob Dancer and Glen Richards
Unfortunately the strategy chart link on videopoker.com for 9/6 Jacks or Better no longer works
http://www.videopoker.com/quickquads/do ... rategy.pdf
9/6 Jacks or Better Quick Quads on the Wizard of Odds
Would help the player to learn the fundamentals by attending the August 16th 2017 seminar at the Southpoint taught by Mr. Dancer
In addition, the GOLD membership on this website has training mode available for the standard Quick Quads.
Unfortunately there are less resources 9/6 Jacks or Better Wheel Poker with Quick Quads so this will be a good direction
As a heads up, making the adjustment to play the full bells and whistles WPwQQ will require the additional effort.
There will be no training mode available on the website for WPwQQ, no feedback available and the player must hope they are doing things right.
A necessary part is to find out the average return of WPwQQ based on a 5-coin scale which is needed for some tools.
Most video poker games are evaluated on a 5-coin scale. WPwQQ requires an additional 2 coins for a 7-coin wager. In respect to 5-coins, it will be 1.4 times the amount (7 divided by 5).
9/6 Jacks or Better WPwQQ returns 99.617% thus
.99617 * 1.4 = 1.394638 or 139.4638% based on 5 coins needed for the next part.
Figuring out the average amount of the Wheel Spin
Using the Wizard of Odds Video Analyzer that calculates the return of most video poker games in 3 seconds, LINK
I specified Quick Quads, Jacks or Better, and then used guesswork on various amounts on the 4 of a Kind part because that is where the increased bonus values are.
I ended up with 393.5 which comes out to a return of 99.6209% which is close to the 99.617% return of the game.
Hence the result is 393.5 – 236 = 157.5 Credits average payout per Wheel Spin.
Using the strategy maker with the adjusted amount (I added 31.5 to the 4 of a Kind) Link
As stated earlier, the following offers slightly higher returns at 99.667% (BP) and 99.674% (DB) returns at the expense of higher variance factors with Wheel Poker AND Quick Quads enabled.
I added 31.5 to the 4 of a Kind
For Bonus Poker Players – Link
For Double Bonus Players – Link
Notable Strategy Differences between 9/6 Jacks or Better QQ and WPwQQ – The intimidating part
225264 out of the 2598960 hands have different holds, so it will be somewhat dangerous to apply standard QQ strategy guide to WPwQQ. I’ve debated the feasibility to use the same strategy, but now it is definitive to use the adjusted strategy.
These are most of the notable differences but not each one. The top 3 differences should be made or else you are better off playing standard Jacks or Better on those errors alone.
Difference #1 – In WPwQQ, you may break up Full Houses with ranks 3 thru 10 full (the trips part and Quick Quad eligible)
For full house with 6/7/8/9/10 full, break it up every time.
If the other pair is of higher rank, discard the pair.
Q ♥ Q ♦ 9 ♥ 9 ♦ 9 ♣
QQ - Q ♥ Q ♦ 9 ♥ 9 ♦ 9 ♣
WPwQQ - 9 ♥ 9 ♦ 9 ♣
If the other pair is of lower rank, hold one of them to get 5 outs at a Quick Quad.
7 ♥ 7 ♦ 8 ♥ 8 ♦ 8 ♣
QQ - 7 ♥ 7 ♦ 8 ♥ 8 ♦ 8 ♣
WPwQQ - 7 ♦ 8 ♥ 8 ♦ 8 ♣
Outs for a Quick Quad: 8 ♠, A ♠, A ♥, A ♦, A ♣
For full house with 3/4/5 full,
Break it up only if the other pair is of lower rank. Hold one of the cards from the lower ranked pair to get 5 outs at a Quick Quad.
3 ♥ 3 ♠4 ♥ 4 ♦ 4 ♣
QQ - 3 ♥ 3 ♠4 ♥ 4 ♦ 4 ♣
WPwQQ - 3 ♠4 ♥ 4 ♦ 4 ♣
Outs for a Quick Quad: 4 ♠, A ♠, A ♥, A ♦, A ♣
Otherwise keep the Full House.
8 ♥ 8 ♦ 5 ♥ 5 ♦ 5 ♣
QQ - 8 ♥ 8 ♦ 5 ♥ 5 ♦ 5 ♣
WPwQQ - 8 ♥ 8 ♦ 5 ♥ 5 ♦ 5 ♣
The potential EV difference is 6.66 – 12.255 credits per line played. For quarters, it can be as much as $3 error.
Difference #2 – In WPwQQ, you break up a 4 to 5,6,7 high Inside Straight Flush when a Quick Quad opportunity arises.
5 ♥ 5 ♦ 2 ♥ 3 ♥ 6 ♥
QQ - 5 ♥ 2 ♥ 3 ♥ 6 ♥
WPwQQ - 5 ♥ 5 ♦ 2 ♥ 3 ♥
7 ♥ 7 ♦ 3 ♥ 4 ♥ 6 ♥
QQ - 7 ♥ 3 ♥ 4 ♥ 6 ♥
WPwQQ - 7 ♥ 7 ♦ 3 ♥ 4 ♥
The Quick Quad opportunity has an EV of 18 credits whereas inside straight flushes is 11.7 or 12.02 (with 5 high straight flush because of the Ace). With a 6 credit difference, that is the reason you do it.
Difference #3 – In WPwQQ, you break up dealt two pairs when the 5th card presents a Quick Quad opportunity.
A ♥ A ♦ 6 ♥ 6 ♣ 5 ♥
QQ - A ♥ A ♦ 6 ♥ 6 ♣
WPwQQ - A ♥ 6 ♥ 6 ♣ 5 ♥
2 ♥ 2 ♦ 7 ♥ 7 ♦ 5 ♣
QQ - 2 ♥ 2 ♦ 7 ♥ 7 ♦
WPwQQ - 2 ♥ 7 ♥ 7 ♦ 5 ♣
The Quick Quad opportunity has an EV of 18 credits two pairs is about 13 credits with a guaranteed 10 credit payout had the player kept the two pairs. With a 5 credit difference, that is the reason you do it.
Difference #4 – In WPwQQ, you hold low pairs (4 through 10) over 4 to Flush and 9 or 10 pair over 3 to a Royal Flush
8 ♥ 8 ♦ 3 ♥ 4 ♥ 10 ♥
QQ - 8 ♥ 3 ♥ 4 ♥ 10 ♥
WPwQQ - 8 ♥ 8 ♦
9 ♥ 9 ♦ A ♣ J ♣ Q ♣
QQ - A ♣ J ♣ Q ♣
WPwQQ - 9 ♥ 9 ♦
This is more of the Wheel Poker strategy aspect. All pairs have raised EV values for its possibility to spin a wheel when a quad is formed. There will be a 1.24 credit loss for players that do not. The 9 and 10 have the greatest number of combinations to form a Quick Quad so it is more valuable than 3 to Royal Flush.
Difference #5 – In WPwQQ, for low pairs (2s through 6s) you hold one lower rank card if it is present to be eligible for Quick Quad
5 ♥ 5 ♦ 3 ♥ 6 ♣ 9 ♥
QQ - 5 ♥ 5 ♦
WPwQQ - 5 ♥ 5 ♦ 3 ♥
Most challenging part in WPwQQ, each time the player does not, they sacrifice 1 credit in EV.
Difference #6 – In WPwQQ, 3 to Flush is more valuable than a high card, 2 unsuited high cards, or Jack+Ten suited when the ranks add up to a Quick Quad.
2 ♥ 7 ♦ 8 ♥ 10 ♥ K ♣
QQ - K ♣
WPwQQ - 2 ♥ 8 ♥ 10 ♥
The 235 Straight Flush beats a 2345 Straight when the fifth card is not a high card Jack/Queen/King
2 ♥ 3 ♥ 4 ♦ 5 ♥ 7 ♣
QQ - 2 ♥ 3 ♥ 4 ♦ 5 ♥
WPwQQ - 2 ♥ 3 ♥ 5 ♥
The player is required to pay attention to 3 to a Flush now.
Difference #7 – In WPwQQ, 235 offsuit, a single 10, or a single 9 in that order is better than Nothing
2 â™ 3 ♥ 5 ♦ 8 ♣ 10 â™
QQ -
WPwQQ - 2 ♠3 ♥ 5 ♦
Probably the first time ever I’ve heard this 235 strategy but it is on the basic strategy charts.
Difference #8 – In WPwQQ, if there are 3 unsuited high cards with an Ace, the lone Ace is held since it can contribute to Quick Quad formation on the draw
A ♥ 2 ♥ 3 ♦ J ♦ K ♣
QQ - J ♦ K ♣
WPwQQ - A ♥
There are many entries in the Strategy Exceptions, but will only allow the Player to gain 0.00009% of EV.
Wheel Spin Amount Odds
50 Credits 1 in 7.69 (13%)
60 Credits 1 in 6.46 (15.48%)
80 Credits 1 in 7.69 (13%)
100 Credits 1 in 9.79 (10.215%)
125 Credits 1 in 14.68 (6.812%)
150 Credits 1 in 7.18 (13.928%)
200 Credits 1 in 8.5 (11.765%)
250 Credits 1 in 9.5 (10.526%)
500 Credits 1 in 29.36 (3.406%)
1000 Credits 1 in 80.75 (1.238%)
2000 Credits 1 in 161.5 (0.619%)
Hopefully, players are not too discouraged from playing WPwQQ, it can definitely be an enjoyable game as it is high variance. I hope I am right that this game is for the highly skilled.
Disclaimer: The Southpoint Casino is one of very few casinos to have Wheel Poker with Quick Quads available for real money wagers. Hence this will be only useful for players who are able to play there as a local or have plans to visit there as a non-local.
“The Southpoint Casino has more than 10,000 video poker games returning over 99%, that is more than anyone else has.†A quote from Mr. Dancer during GWAE commercial breaks, as the Southpoint is one of the main sponsors of the show. I might have also seen a billboard as well.
Wheel Poker w/Quick Quads is one of the games that fit that description. As one of the top video poker casinos in the nation, I would presume that they also have the top skilled players as well. Upon initial glance at the strategy, I am convinced that It will take a highly skilled player or someone who has completed Mr. Dancer’s video poker seminar to take on this game.
What is this game Wheel Poker w/Quick Quads (WPwQQ)?
The title of the game says it all, it combines the elements of two specialty games, Wheel Poker and Quick Quads. Quick Quads is a game that allows players to achieve quads 2.6 times easier with adjusted strategy approach for an additional credit wager, from having a 5-card result of trips and the other two cards adding up in rank matching the rank of the trips (e.g. 9h-9s-9c-6c-3d, 6 + 3 = 9). Wheel Poker offers bonus credit amounts to the player if they hit a quad for an additional credit wager. These two complement each other very nicely, but I will not know the backstory of the rarity of this game.
The Wheel Poker w/Quick Quads is one of the few remaining games that offers flexible wagers to the player.
Take for example this Triple Play setting. Press the Bet One carefully to set up the wager.
At Bet 15 Credits, you will have a multiline 9/6 Jacks or Better game
At Bet 18 Credits, you will have a multiline 9/6 Jacks or Better with Quick Quads enabled. The notable change is that the Four of a Kind pays 236 credits. The 9/6 Jacks or Better normal Quick Quads on videopoker.com pays 235 credits.
This alone (from 236 to 235) lowers the payout to 99.507% (strategy is less aggressive towards quads) and will be inaccurate to practice should the Player only want to do just the QQ.
At Bet 21 Credits or with a single push of the Bet MAX button, the player has both Quick Quads and Wheel Poker
The Game Returns for each feature
The standard 9/6 Jacks or Better returns 99.544% to the player with optimal plays. An outstanding offer I would take.
The 9/6 Jacks or Better with Quick Quads returns 99.609%, a few hundredth percent more return, but with the necessary strategy adjustments (more on that later).
The full Wheel Poker and Quick Quads returns 99.617%, a few thousandth percent more return, but with more strategy adjustments than the Quick Quad standalone.
Resources Available for 9/6 Jacks or Better Quick Quads
PDF book – A Quick Guide to Quick Quads by Bob Dancer and Glen Richards
Unfortunately the strategy chart link on videopoker.com for 9/6 Jacks or Better no longer works
http://www.videopoker.com/quickquads/do ... rategy.pdf
9/6 Jacks or Better Quick Quads on the Wizard of Odds
Would help the player to learn the fundamentals by attending the August 16th 2017 seminar at the Southpoint taught by Mr. Dancer
In addition, the GOLD membership on this website has training mode available for the standard Quick Quads.
Unfortunately there are less resources 9/6 Jacks or Better Wheel Poker with Quick Quads so this will be a good direction
As a heads up, making the adjustment to play the full bells and whistles WPwQQ will require the additional effort.
There will be no training mode available on the website for WPwQQ, no feedback available and the player must hope they are doing things right.
A necessary part is to find out the average return of WPwQQ based on a 5-coin scale which is needed for some tools.
Most video poker games are evaluated on a 5-coin scale. WPwQQ requires an additional 2 coins for a 7-coin wager. In respect to 5-coins, it will be 1.4 times the amount (7 divided by 5).
9/6 Jacks or Better WPwQQ returns 99.617% thus
.99617 * 1.4 = 1.394638 or 139.4638% based on 5 coins needed for the next part.
Figuring out the average amount of the Wheel Spin
Using the Wizard of Odds Video Analyzer that calculates the return of most video poker games in 3 seconds, LINK
I specified Quick Quads, Jacks or Better, and then used guesswork on various amounts on the 4 of a Kind part because that is where the increased bonus values are.
I ended up with 393.5 which comes out to a return of 99.6209% which is close to the 99.617% return of the game.
Hence the result is 393.5 – 236 = 157.5 Credits average payout per Wheel Spin.
Using the strategy maker with the adjusted amount (I added 31.5 to the 4 of a Kind) Link
As stated earlier, the following offers slightly higher returns at 99.667% (BP) and 99.674% (DB) returns at the expense of higher variance factors with Wheel Poker AND Quick Quads enabled.
I added 31.5 to the 4 of a Kind
For Bonus Poker Players – Link
For Double Bonus Players – Link
Notable Strategy Differences between 9/6 Jacks or Better QQ and WPwQQ – The intimidating part
225264 out of the 2598960 hands have different holds, so it will be somewhat dangerous to apply standard QQ strategy guide to WPwQQ. I’ve debated the feasibility to use the same strategy, but now it is definitive to use the adjusted strategy.
These are most of the notable differences but not each one. The top 3 differences should be made or else you are better off playing standard Jacks or Better on those errors alone.
Difference #1 – In WPwQQ, you may break up Full Houses with ranks 3 thru 10 full (the trips part and Quick Quad eligible)
For full house with 6/7/8/9/10 full, break it up every time.
If the other pair is of higher rank, discard the pair.
Q ♥ Q ♦ 9 ♥ 9 ♦ 9 ♣
QQ - Q ♥ Q ♦ 9 ♥ 9 ♦ 9 ♣
WPwQQ - 9 ♥ 9 ♦ 9 ♣
If the other pair is of lower rank, hold one of them to get 5 outs at a Quick Quad.
7 ♥ 7 ♦ 8 ♥ 8 ♦ 8 ♣
QQ - 7 ♥ 7 ♦ 8 ♥ 8 ♦ 8 ♣
WPwQQ - 7 ♦ 8 ♥ 8 ♦ 8 ♣
Outs for a Quick Quad: 8 ♠, A ♠, A ♥, A ♦, A ♣
For full house with 3/4/5 full,
Break it up only if the other pair is of lower rank. Hold one of the cards from the lower ranked pair to get 5 outs at a Quick Quad.
3 ♥ 3 ♠4 ♥ 4 ♦ 4 ♣
QQ - 3 ♥ 3 ♠4 ♥ 4 ♦ 4 ♣
WPwQQ - 3 ♠4 ♥ 4 ♦ 4 ♣
Outs for a Quick Quad: 4 ♠, A ♠, A ♥, A ♦, A ♣
Otherwise keep the Full House.
8 ♥ 8 ♦ 5 ♥ 5 ♦ 5 ♣
QQ - 8 ♥ 8 ♦ 5 ♥ 5 ♦ 5 ♣
WPwQQ - 8 ♥ 8 ♦ 5 ♥ 5 ♦ 5 ♣
The potential EV difference is 6.66 – 12.255 credits per line played. For quarters, it can be as much as $3 error.
Difference #2 – In WPwQQ, you break up a 4 to 5,6,7 high Inside Straight Flush when a Quick Quad opportunity arises.
5 ♥ 5 ♦ 2 ♥ 3 ♥ 6 ♥
QQ - 5 ♥ 2 ♥ 3 ♥ 6 ♥
WPwQQ - 5 ♥ 5 ♦ 2 ♥ 3 ♥
7 ♥ 7 ♦ 3 ♥ 4 ♥ 6 ♥
QQ - 7 ♥ 3 ♥ 4 ♥ 6 ♥
WPwQQ - 7 ♥ 7 ♦ 3 ♥ 4 ♥
The Quick Quad opportunity has an EV of 18 credits whereas inside straight flushes is 11.7 or 12.02 (with 5 high straight flush because of the Ace). With a 6 credit difference, that is the reason you do it.
Difference #3 – In WPwQQ, you break up dealt two pairs when the 5th card presents a Quick Quad opportunity.
A ♥ A ♦ 6 ♥ 6 ♣ 5 ♥
QQ - A ♥ A ♦ 6 ♥ 6 ♣
WPwQQ - A ♥ 6 ♥ 6 ♣ 5 ♥
2 ♥ 2 ♦ 7 ♥ 7 ♦ 5 ♣
QQ - 2 ♥ 2 ♦ 7 ♥ 7 ♦
WPwQQ - 2 ♥ 7 ♥ 7 ♦ 5 ♣
The Quick Quad opportunity has an EV of 18 credits two pairs is about 13 credits with a guaranteed 10 credit payout had the player kept the two pairs. With a 5 credit difference, that is the reason you do it.
Difference #4 – In WPwQQ, you hold low pairs (4 through 10) over 4 to Flush and 9 or 10 pair over 3 to a Royal Flush
8 ♥ 8 ♦ 3 ♥ 4 ♥ 10 ♥
QQ - 8 ♥ 3 ♥ 4 ♥ 10 ♥
WPwQQ - 8 ♥ 8 ♦
9 ♥ 9 ♦ A ♣ J ♣ Q ♣
QQ - A ♣ J ♣ Q ♣
WPwQQ - 9 ♥ 9 ♦
This is more of the Wheel Poker strategy aspect. All pairs have raised EV values for its possibility to spin a wheel when a quad is formed. There will be a 1.24 credit loss for players that do not. The 9 and 10 have the greatest number of combinations to form a Quick Quad so it is more valuable than 3 to Royal Flush.
Difference #5 – In WPwQQ, for low pairs (2s through 6s) you hold one lower rank card if it is present to be eligible for Quick Quad
5 ♥ 5 ♦ 3 ♥ 6 ♣ 9 ♥
QQ - 5 ♥ 5 ♦
WPwQQ - 5 ♥ 5 ♦ 3 ♥
Most challenging part in WPwQQ, each time the player does not, they sacrifice 1 credit in EV.
Difference #6 – In WPwQQ, 3 to Flush is more valuable than a high card, 2 unsuited high cards, or Jack+Ten suited when the ranks add up to a Quick Quad.
2 ♥ 7 ♦ 8 ♥ 10 ♥ K ♣
QQ - K ♣
WPwQQ - 2 ♥ 8 ♥ 10 ♥
The 235 Straight Flush beats a 2345 Straight when the fifth card is not a high card Jack/Queen/King
2 ♥ 3 ♥ 4 ♦ 5 ♥ 7 ♣
QQ - 2 ♥ 3 ♥ 4 ♦ 5 ♥
WPwQQ - 2 ♥ 3 ♥ 5 ♥
The player is required to pay attention to 3 to a Flush now.
Difference #7 – In WPwQQ, 235 offsuit, a single 10, or a single 9 in that order is better than Nothing
2 â™ 3 ♥ 5 ♦ 8 ♣ 10 â™
QQ -
WPwQQ - 2 ♠3 ♥ 5 ♦
Probably the first time ever I’ve heard this 235 strategy but it is on the basic strategy charts.
Difference #8 – In WPwQQ, if there are 3 unsuited high cards with an Ace, the lone Ace is held since it can contribute to Quick Quad formation on the draw
A ♥ 2 ♥ 3 ♦ J ♦ K ♣
QQ - J ♦ K ♣
WPwQQ - A ♥
There are many entries in the Strategy Exceptions, but will only allow the Player to gain 0.00009% of EV.
Wheel Spin Amount Odds
50 Credits 1 in 7.69 (13%)
60 Credits 1 in 6.46 (15.48%)
80 Credits 1 in 7.69 (13%)
100 Credits 1 in 9.79 (10.215%)
125 Credits 1 in 14.68 (6.812%)
150 Credits 1 in 7.18 (13.928%)
200 Credits 1 in 8.5 (11.765%)
250 Credits 1 in 9.5 (10.526%)
500 Credits 1 in 29.36 (3.406%)
1000 Credits 1 in 80.75 (1.238%)
2000 Credits 1 in 161.5 (0.619%)
Hopefully, players are not too discouraged from playing WPwQQ, it can definitely be an enjoyable game as it is high variance. I hope I am right that this game is for the highly skilled.