Do casino's love or hate VP players?

Discuss proper hold strategies and "advantage play" and ask questions about how to improve your play.
Gronbog
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Re: Do casino's love or hate VP players?

Post by Gronbog »

Heh -- Brunson's parents would be extremely old!

FloridaPhil
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Post by FloridaPhil »

I'm not that old yet. He's one of the younger players.

FloridaPhil
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Post by FloridaPhil »

Back to the love hate thing. I suppose players think casinos dislike video poker players because they keep dropping the odds and comps? The casino knows the house edge on VP is smaller than slots. No one knows what the house edge is on our slots as they are not regulated. Some knowledgeable players say it's around 10%. I think casinos still make money on video poker games, especially the larger denomination games. I watch players pump hundred dollar bills into dollar 8/5 DDB like there's no tomorrow. Before I understood the math, I was one of them.

As players get better or move to smaller denominations, the house profit is reduced. If you teach people to be better players, the casino has to do something to make up for the loss in revenue. Marketing can only go so far. A player reads somewhere that a well known celebrity or VP pro wins big. This may cause them to temporarily bet more or bigger. When it doesn't work out well, it's back to quarters.

Consider a video poker machine as a parking meter. A quarter player is parking for 2% an hour. 2% of a bunch of quarters isn't enough to pay for the machine. A $5 dollar player is parking for .5% of a stack of hundred dollar bills. That's the kind of players the casino wants to attract, so they shower them with comps. There aren't many $5 players, so the odds are dropped on the multitude of small players.

Slot machines are the heart of all casino profits. If a game doesn't make enough money, it's gone. If everyone in the world did as the experts advise and walked away from negative games, VP would become as obsolete as a pin ball machine. If you play video poker today, you should realize that at some point and time your odds and comps are going to be reduced. Not because the casino hates you. They want to keep the lights on.

I don't like it when my game odds are reduced and my comps are cut. I have three choices. I can stop playing. I can start shoving thousands into $5 games praying that I won't lose $100K or I can play cheaper and accept the cost as a fee for using the machine. I like the last choice because it lets me play the game I love without the stress and depression of losing a lot of money. Which one you choose is up to you.

wildman49
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Post by wildman49 »

I have been watching players next to me more then normal. Seeing there holds. I can say almost every player I see don't know correct holds on the games they are playing. The casino still makes a 1% or 2 extra on them weak players.

Lowering the pay tables a tiny bit is not going to make or break the casinos bottom line. I see very very few players playing higher then quarters. Yesterday many machines I sat at the last player was playing less then 5 coins. I saw players playing 1 nickel a hand just yesterday.

Slots is where the casino makes its take, VP is still the best play.

advantage playe
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Post by advantage playe »

hey fl phil,i love the parking meter analogy its the only p meter where u decide what to pay.Sometimes its broken and it pays you!!try finding one of them in manhattan!!

FloridaPhil
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Post by FloridaPhil »

advantage playe wrote:
Sat Nov 10, 2018 11:39 am
hey fl phil,i love the parking meter analogy its the only p meter where u decide what to pay.Sometimes its broken and it pays you!!try finding one of them in manhattan!!
I got paid yesterday. I have determined that 90% of player losses are self inflicted. Nothing works all the time. Losses are part of the game. All strategies work until they don't. What is required is a strategy that fits the games you have to play, your bankroll, your personal expectations and your tolerance for adversity. There is no single VP strategy that fits everyone the same because we are all different.

Greed and panic are my biggest flaws. I'm greedy when I hit a decent jackpot and try to parlay it into an even bigger jackpot. I panic when I am behind and take risks that hardly ever work out. Realizing your flaws is part of fixing them. My VP is a personal work in progress.

Sea Lion
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Post by Sea Lion »

Do casino's love or hate VP players? Boyd Gaming answered that one loud and clear. First with the huge downgrade of the 50+ Young At Heart earlier this year, then when they restructured the players club last Summer.... :down:

billryan
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Post by billryan »

When a door closes, a window opens. Sure, Stations downgraded one aspect of their program but …..

olds442jetaway
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Post by olds442jetaway »

To answer BRs earlier question, I have tried slots off and on over the years and get totally bored in about 5 minutes. I like the challenge of vp and can play 8 hours straight without ever getting bored. My mind is constantly racing with math scenarios though i know each hand is independant. For me, its not just about the money. As i’ve posted before it is about the entire experience and people not just you against the machines. Finally, most of the free stuff I don’t need or want. Actually I wish my free stuff would be limited to free play, rooms, and a coffee or sandwich now and then.

DougJ
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Post by DougJ »

wildman49 wrote:
Sat Nov 10, 2018 7:04 am
I have been watching players next to me more then normal. Seeing there holds. I can say almost every player I see don't know correct holds on the games they are playing. The casino still makes a 1% or 2 extra on them weak players.

. . . . .
+1

Last weekend, had a "staycation" for 3 nights at Wynn. Not wanting to play crappy pay tables, I put $20 in a VP machine and played one quarter at a time, just to observe nearby players without looking like a stalker. It was a time waster in between dinner and the "La Reve" show.

Holy Cow, watching folks play multi-line $25 a spin, and being totally clueless about holds. They were clearly the "graduates" of those South Point VP classes on how to play to "win".

I enjoyed my two hours of watching. I lost my $20. La Reve was awesome.

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