Comps for the low budget gambler

The lighter side... playing for entertainment, less concerned about "the math."
wildman49
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Re: Comps for the low budget gambler

Post by wildman49 »

Eduardo wrote:
Sat May 02, 2020 12:31 pm
Advantage players likely see it very differently. They are taking advantage of a system that wasn't really designed for them. Can't fault them for it. Unfortunately, it probably has reduced comps for the rest of us as casinos try to avoid being exploited.
So very right Eduardo. I love AP. It gets my blood flowing. Knowing I can play hard for many hours and have an advantage is what it's all about for me. It's my crack cocaine if you will, my high.

I do want to help others to get max out of there comps under recreational play even if I play AP most every trip.

Even if your a low roller budget player you can do some things to help your comp value.

I believe I have come to understand the computer program used to award free play plus. This understanding of the program was in the back of my head for many months. Tech58 a player where I play put something in my head and it took me 6 months to understand it. He told me he had it out with a host about sessions of play and it took me time to understand it. I was told by my casino host that the casino I play at was one of the last around to go to this program that is widely used by all casinos.

I think most all of you players can see below the session photo I posted as the same as you see when you put in your card and play. The casino clocks your play per session. Once you put your card in it starts a session. When you remove your card it ends the session. These sessions become your average over a three month time frame.

But the most important thing is these sessions are clocked from top of thee hour to top of thee hour. If you play say 4 sessions (moving to different machines 4 times) of 500 points, in a hour for a total of 2000 points your average is 500. Say another guy does 2000 points from top of the hour to top of the hour on the does not move machines his average is 2000.

This is something everyone reading this can try/work on when the casinos reopen. I think you will find your comp might be much higher not moving till near the top of the hour. Also making sure you start play a few minutes after the top of the hour to play to as near the next top of the hour you can.

I am near 90% sure this will work you for many of you out there. I was 2 and 1/2 months into my tests when the virus shut down the casino. From the info I have I hope some of you all can give this a try when things open up and report you findings on comp value.



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Come Back Kid
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Post by Come Back Kid »

This is so interesting Wildman...Would you remove your card after an hour and start over?

wildman49
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Post by wildman49 »

Come Back Kid wrote:
Sun May 03, 2020 5:54 am
This is so interesting Wildman...Would you remove your card after an hour and start over?
CBK as I said I was still in test mode on this and do think it can make a world of differences in ones comps if they can play the full hour on one machine. If I am holding my own I just play another full hour on that same machine and have played as many as 5 hours at the same machine.

Yes I do move just before the hour to another machine and start a min or two after the next hour starts if the machine I left was not to my liking.

The more high sessions you can put together per full hour the higher your average over time. I was putting in less coin per month and found my free play did not go down. I really need 3 months of data to be sure but it was working in that short time I was working with it.

I used to be a hit and run player for years and never knew it was not good on comps playing short sessions.

Also I used to just play off free play and leave to get to work. I found out I was getting a zero session as I would play out free play to the exact dollar. The zero sessions killed my average month after month.

Come Back Kid
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Post by Come Back Kid »

Thanks Wildman....I'll be curious for sure!

pokerpokerpoker
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Post by pokerpokerpoker »

Exact info is hard to find. I've asked club booth workers directly "How much coin-in to get how much FP". That goes nowhere.

I did learn that this month's FP mailers was based on play 2 months ago.

I almost always play short sessions for $1 at the better games with the highest variance. Typically once per week with an $800 BR (sometimes more, sometimes less). Usually I would either bust-out quickly, or, hit a nice jackpot. Seldom anything in between. Anytime I had FP worth picking up I would do so and no-play that day. Of course, my offers were generally poor - maybe $10 FP twice per week.

A few days into the new year I tilted badly and donked off $2200+ in one session of maybe 3 hours. Disgusted, (and busted) I stayed away for 2 whole months. Like clockwork, on March First, my offers soared - $50 twice a week and a bonus on Sunday.

I intended on just hit and running the FP to see how long it would last. Then, the virus hit. And oh yeah, on one FP mission I found a TDB game I couldn't resist and hit 3 AWAK in 3 sessions. Who knows what kind of offers I'll get when they re-open.

But, as far as mailers go, I firmly believe it is better to play big on infrequent occasions than to play small frequently.

Vman96
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Post by Vman96 »

wildman49 wrote:
Sun May 03, 2020 7:52 am
Come Back Kid wrote:
Sun May 03, 2020 5:54 am
This is so interesting Wildman...Would you remove your card after an hour and start over?
CBK as I said I was still in test mode on this and do think it can make a world of differences in ones comps if they can play the full hour on one machine. If I am holding my own I just play another full hour on that same machine and have played as many as 5 hours at the same machine.

Yes I do move just before the hour to another machine and start a min or two after the next hour starts if the machine I left was not to my liking.

The more high sessions you can put together per full hour the higher your average over time. I was putting in less coin per month and found my free play did not go down. I really need 3 months of data to be sure but it was working in that short time I was working with it.

I used to be a hit and run player for years and never knew it was not good on comps playing short sessions.

Also I used to just play off free play and leave to get to work. I found out I was getting a zero session as I would play out free play to the exact dollar. The zero sessions killed my average month after month.
Virtually no casino does it this way and I would be shocked if the one you're playing at did.

Many casinos nationwide examines your play over the course of the entire "gaming day". Why would a casino ever punish a machine hopper that drastically? What difference does it make if a player put in $10k coin-in on just one machine, or if a player spreads it around 30 different machines? Assuming it's the same paytable, the casino expects to make the SAME amount of money. So why reward the "squatter" much more in comps?

onemoretry
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Post by onemoretry »

Vman96 wrote:
Thu May 07, 2020 2:36 pm
What difference does it make if a player put in $10k coin-in on just one machine, or if a player spreads it around 30 different machines? Assuming it's the same paytable, the casino expects to make the SAME amount of money. So why reward the "squatter" much more in comps?
I tend to agree that it makes no sense at all for a casino to punish players who spread their play amongst several machines, as long as their total coinin is the same.

However, who ever said that everything that casinos do makes sense?

tech58
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Post by tech58 »

Vman96 wrote:
Thu May 07, 2020 2:36 pm
wildman49 wrote:
Sun May 03, 2020 7:52 am
Come Back Kid wrote:
Sun May 03, 2020 5:54 am
This is so interesting Wildman...Would you remove your card after an hour and start over?
CBK as I said I was still in test mode on this and do think it can make a world of differences in ones comps if they can play the full hour on one machine. If I am holding my own I just play another full hour on that same machine and have played as many as 5 hours at the same machine.

Yes I do move just before the hour to another machine and start a min or two after the next hour starts if the machine I left was not to my liking.

The more high sessions you can put together per full hour the higher your average over time. I was putting in less coin per month and found my free play did not go down. I really need 3 months of data to be sure but it was working in that short time I was working with it.

I used to be a hit and run player for years and never knew it was not good on comps playing short sessions.

Also I used to just play off free play and leave to get to work. I found out I was getting a zero session as I would play out free play to the exact dollar. The zero sessions killed my average month after month.
Virtually no casino does it this way and I would be shocked if the one you're playing at did.

Many casinos nationwide examines your play over the course of the entire "gaming day". Why would a casino ever punish a machine hopper that drastically? What difference does it make if a player put in $10k coin-in on just one machine, or if a player spreads it around 30 different machines? Assuming it's the same paytable, the casino expects to make the SAME amount of money. So why reward the "squatter" much more in comps?
"Virtually no casino does it this way" is totally not true!
I can verify everything Wildman is saying is factual about the computer program that determines free-play at our casino. I have seen the graph of actual play which supports his every point!
The difference that it makes is that the casino recognizes that hit-and-run is not to their advantage.
This is why they penalize short sessions.
The "squatter" is, in their opinion,holding still while the casino edge grinds away at their BR.
The truth is that many casinos nationwide do this exact same thing!
If no one asks questions then no one knows. Even some hosts claim to not know how the program works.

As Wildman mentioned this is still a work in progress. He is attempting to reach out to other players who may help to fill in the blanks.

So, if you don't know,at least don't distract others who seek to learn.

olds442jetaway
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Post by olds442jetaway »

The casinos know the psychology of the gambler. A player who is stubborn and mesmerized sitting at the same machine for hours on end will feed that machine until a massive jackpot is hit or he/she runs out of money. We already know what usually happens. I know from personal experience that machine hopping costs me way less money than playing at one machine.
When hopping, one tends to eventually hit a machine that was ready to hit or you get disgusted earlier and go home or find something else to do at the casino. I know there is no such thing as ready to hit, but how many times have you seen someone get their clock cleaned and someone sits down and that same machine starts to hit immediately. I keep very good track of my coin in for a given gaming day. I akso keep track of my comps based on my play level and style of play. There is no question that sitting, feeding, and playing at the same machine for an entire session, brings higher comp offers than hopping. That said, vp comps are a pittance compared to slot players. My friend plays dollar slots 3 bucks a shot. Many times in prior years I would average 3 bucks a hand playing 99 percent vp. Next trip or so my free play might be 20 bucks and his from 250 to 500 bucks. Way better hotel, show, room, and food offers too. Of course his long term return is about 91 percent. Mine about 98 percent. But long term is millions of hands or pulls.

davidearl
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Post by davidearl »

I can also verify what Wildman and Tech said about our casino. I can also add that their software programs do it the same way as Vegas casinos when it comes to entertainment acts. They look at the total revenue for the night. Casino, hotel, resort, restaurants, ticket sales and stores.
It stands to reason, that they are using the same programs.

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