The Two Camps

[FloridaPhil]

[quote=spxChrome]

Everyone should thank this group its the reason all you math and recreation players have a casino to go to. [/quote]Absolutely.  It was always curious to me why someone would get so upset because someone else announced they enjoy taking chances.  If you're concerned that they may start teaching classes on being a fool, maybe.Gambling is all about taking chances.  In the short term throwing old bones in the air may be a better predictor than mathematics.   I'm never going to live long enough to care that much about my results.  I'm in it for the fun and that's what I do.  Like I say...

[onemoretry]

Gambling is all about taking chances. That's very true. I would add that intelligent gambling includes evaluating the potential reward versus the likelihood, or unlikelihood, of success, to decide if a wager is reasonable.

[FloridaPhil]

"Intelligent Gambling"    A true oxymoron if I ever heard one.  People play VP for all manner of reasons.   Most of them have nothing to do with evaluating the potential for profit or likelihood of success.  Some do and I can respect that.There is nothing wrong with getting paid to do the things you enjoy doing.   If you can figure out how to make VP profitable, great!   I'll keep my money and put it to work getting paid for my intellect and hard work, not the whims of a RNG chip.  When I'm done working I'll treat myself to some VP as a reward, not another job.

[billryan]

I love it when people have been shown the way to do something successfully, but because they are too dumb to do it themselves, decide no one can do it.

[FloridaPhil]

[quote=billryan]I love it when people have been shown the way to do something
successfully, but because they are too dumb to do it themselves, decide
no one can do it.[/quote]I never said no one can do it.  I said I don't care.If I want to flush a $100 bill down the toilet once an hour, what's it to you?   As far as I'm concerned gambling is the same thing and I'm fine with it.  The only difference between me and most high rollers is that I'm using a teaspoon and they are using a dump truck!Your mistake is insisting that everyone in the world should define VP "success" the same way as you do.  I don't.  Many of us want to enjoy ourselves, possibly win a little money once in a while and have some fun.   Turning our recreation into a business is not what we are playing for.  Get used to it... 

[Vman96]

Phil,

Another thing to add is the only known fair machines are in Nevada and Colorado. I think Bob Dancer said that in a weekly article a while ago. Other state lotteries consider VP machines a slot machine or just another video lottery terminal.

No way Bob would ever write that. LOL

In MOST states, VP plays EXACTLY like Nevada. Hell, even in Kansas where the state's casinos are OWNED by the lottery and managed by private casino corporations still requires that VP plays exactly like Nevada.

[Waiting4RF]

I think he said it on his weekly radio show.

Bill Ryan said PA and NJ are fair too. I looked up PA regulations and they do not mention video poker. But they do say:

A slot machine is prohibited from automatically altering any function of the slot machine based on internal computation of the hold percentage.

That sounds fair to me.

[Vman96]

I think he said it on his weekly radio show.

Bill Ryan said PA and NJ are fair too. I looked up PA regulations and they do not mention video poker. But they do say:

A slot machine is prohibited from automatically altering any function of the slot machine based on internal computation of the hold percentage.

That sounds fair to me.

You're not reading the law hard enough. Believe me...I've wasted HOURS of my life on researching things like this, and still people on this forum don't believe me.

I've had the "New Jersey argument" with this forum in the past. No one has proved me wrong.

Pennsylvania is the same as the New Jersey argument, unfortunately. Not surprising because PA basically copied NJ's regulation style when creating their laws. But anyone that has sufficient mathematical skill will realize that ONLY a random, standard poker deck with probabilities equal to a live deck (ala Nevada) is a MUST for the bolded term to be true.

(f) The available winning combinations and applicable rules of play for a slot machine
shall be available at all times the slot machine is idle to the patron playing the slot machine. The
award schedule of available winning combinations may not include possible aggregate awards
achievable from free plays. A slot machine that includes a strategy choice must provide
mathematically sufficient information for a patron to use optimal skill. Information regarding a
strategy choice need not be made available for any strategy decisions whenever the patron is not
required, in addition to the initial wager, to make an additional wager and, when as a result of
playing a strategy choice, the patron cannot lose any credits earned thus far during that game
play.


And can you lead me to this radio show and the time mark where he says this?? I truly cannot believe Bob is that poorly informed about other states, especially when he makes a big deal about pointing out when others are wrong.

[FloridaPhil]

I think it's fun to talk about gaming rules and rigged machines. We all wonder about those things and I can see some members are passionate about this issue.   I have a serious question for the forum.   Do you think you could tell if a VP machine was rigged by a couple of percent in the casino's favor?  How long would it take for you to suspect it?   If you lined up 10 VP machines in front of an experienced VP tech, do you think he could pick out one rigged machine just by playing it?  Do you think Bob Dancer could?I'm not saying anything in VP is rigged or that the games aren't fair, so don't get excited.  I'm not asking about the regulations either.   I'm asking if you would know if they were rigged?

[paco13]

Rigged VP machines, probably not. Especially just by playing them. Bad sessions could/would be chalked up to Plain bad luck most likely. VLT's however are easy to pick out. They have bonus cards or genie's that pop up to correct play's or awards. If you want to find out in a hurry just throw out your first paying pair. If it is a VLT 1 of 3 things will happen. You will draw another paying pair or better, a genie will appear and fix it after the draw, a bonus match card award will equal the amount you were intended to win. You may even end up with a higher amount awarded if the game intended on a higher paying hand after the draw but you will end up with at least the amount for the paying pair you threw away.