State whether or not you have won....

[Tedlark]

[QUOTE=Tedlark]      Ehh, reading one article about Illinois casino gaming does not mean you know EVERYTHING DaBurglar. Youo may think you do but, sorry.   It's true that the last gaming bill that was brought for a vote was sponsored by State Rep Robert Rita but he was only thrust into the position of bill sponsor less than 2 years ago. Previously the lead sponsor of the gaming bills that did not pass or were vetoed by the Governor was a man from the north suburbs.    As for the tax Illinois levies casinos on revenue, it is one of the highest in the country, if not THE highest. Also in line with taxes, casinos are charged a licensing fee and this number is in the hundreds of millions.    There was an Illinois casino gaming license that was dormant for several years. This was because the license was smack dab in the middle of a legal dispute because a local politician tried to angle to get a casino in his town and he got caught and the whole house of cards came crashing down. That particular license is now held by the gaming company owned by Neil Blum, you should recognize his name because he also owns a casino in the PA area.    There are no casinos located near our border states that have casino gambling. Misouri and Iowa are the exceptions and this is only because the Illinois casinos were up and running before the casinos in these neighboring states were. The Indiana casinos have a freeway leading right to them that many Illinois gamblers drive every day and this is because there are no Illinois casinos nearby to absorb these players.    Illinois casinos, by law, are allowed no more than 1,200 gaming positions, entirely. Included in this count are such things as: craps tables (14 gaming positions, BJ tables 7 gaming positions, etc.). A portion inside Mr. Rita's bill would have expanded the number of gaming positions in existing casinos by the way.    So DaBurglar that is a little primer on Illinois gaming for you. Now you know more about Illinois casino gaming than you know about New Jersey casino gaming. PffftWHERE DID I SAY I KNOW EVERYTHING ABOUT ILLINOIS CASINOS?    You are really an insecure person....your state is a total mess, cannot solve a darn thing, and it is well known......Illinois' problems REGULARLY make the local and national news (as notes1 also points out in his post).....you do not need to live there to understand things.But....POINT OF FACT (ohh love saying that)  I have read MORE than one article and so I categorically REJECT your version of things.....so that settles it.   No need to discuss anything anymore, right?  Ok   on we go.....

[/QUOTE]
   So POINT OF HEAD; if you did read more than one article then maybe you would have known more of what you speak. Mr. Scott; one to beam up. Aye Captain...

[Tedlark]

Just to add: As we know, Illinois is one screwed up state very much in need of additional revenue. But, if the state is so strapped for cash then why is there resistance toward expanding casino gambling in the state?

[notes1]

Just to add: As we know, Illinois is one screwed up state very much in need of additional revenue. But, if the state is so strapped for cash then why is there resistance toward expanding casino gambling in the state?
  your state is not alone, it just happens you have more corruption and sense of entitlement (by some) than other states.  as far as why there is resistance, i can only make a guess. ILL is a well educated populice, i think there are enough citizens that recognize casino revenues at best, are a temporary solution to money woes.    the  citizens of your state did this to themselves, but they had a lot of help, from the politicans. this has happened all over the country. government unions bought the pols, gave them their vote and got goodies for their membership, and the public had no idea what was happening.   

[roveer]

Roveer, awesome post.......You do at least admit that something is amiss, and I actually like the way you describe it, how the casinos and game manufacturers are able to reap some short term gains that cause players to lose a lot more  WITHOUT actually breaking any laws or Regs....THAT in a nutshell is what I have been trying to say and what I believe as well.I agree that whatever the casinos are doing to cause us to all be losing in the same manner at the same time is going to HURT them in the long run (it already has and continues to do so).....they can only bleed a dead a animal so long and then there really truly is NOTHING left, NOTHING NOTHING NOTHING  and no amount of tricky promotions or comp giveaways etc will fix that.I also applaud you being able to admit you are in a slump and losing right now, and I especially like how you mention the complete lack of w-2s the last 6 months really sticks out like a sore thumb.   In my mind,  the w-2s / Handpay drought is more PROOF than the simple "am I winning or losing more" question because w-2s are easy to count and easy to see if you have MORE or less in a given period of time (i.e.  the last 5 years  versus previous periods)In my mind this settles  it:   it is clear that players believe today's Video Poker scene is MUCH harder for a player to win (or at least MINIMIZE losses) than at any time in the past, and it is due to the differences in the manner in which machines operate.   This doe snot mean it is RIGGED or there are Regs being broken,   but something is clearly working against us that was NOT there in the past, or not as big a deal

Daburglar:

Sorry buddy, I admit nothing. If you read my post carefully I simply say that it's a possibility. I also say that it might just be random and will go away at some point. At the current time I probably weigh either possibility as 50/50. I do not possess enough information to make an informed opinion yet I believe I have enough education on the matter to make give possible reasons for what we see happening. I'm simply not smart enough to say with any certainty that manipulation (of any sort) is actually happening.

I will say one thing. My current status of "losing" is basically the casinos money right now as I'm really only playing their comps at this point. I've limited my own money to 50 dollars per visit. They are still giving me 2,200/month to play with. When that will run out who knows. I expected FEB, but it still came. I expected March, but it still came. They give, I play. I'm sure their profit center of 50/week from Roveer won't support the 2.2k/month comp for very long. In addition I've received over a thousand dollars in gift cards, TV's and other crap gadgets since January so they are still being pretty generous. That soon will end.

Everyone is of their own free mind to think what they want. We all process the information differently. At this point I can't make a definitive decision that the possibilities that I put forth are in fact happening. I guess we are just going to have to join the ranks of UFO's. So much information, yet still no definitive proof.

Roveer

[roveer]

roveer, thanks for responding to my request. lots of interesting thoughts, but as you say, nothing definitive.  let me ask you this and i will grant you that it may just be a simple answer, coming from a simple guy. as you stated and all of us have noticed, there are far fewer VP  players. other than reduced paytables, could it be that with fewer players, fewer hands played, it just takes longer to get thru a cycle on the machine.   

Excellent observation. I have observed better outcomes when there is more activity at the casinos. My regular night used to be Sunday night. I was coming in as all the weekend crowd and the crazy button mashers were leaving. At one time I was fully convinced that Sunday was the time to play because the machines had been thoroughly worked out. I no longer come on Sundays but on Wednesday's when the casino is basically empty and has been for several days. Unfortunately this is when my comps are available and Harrah's just changed their policy that comps expire after 72 hours if not used. At least the PIN code comps that is.

So there may definitely be some validity to what you are asking. I would have to say that in my experience it seemed to have an effect.

Roveer

[roveer]

Amen rascal, amen.

Yuuuppp!!!

[olds442jetaway]

I think the whole casino cycles. If you ever don't play and just walk around for an hour or so, you will see what I mean. Banks of machines both slots and vp hitting all at about the same time, long cold cycles throughout the casino, and so on. There is one thing that I have found to be consistent throughout the years. Friday night is the worst night by far for vp and that is usually when we go. On the other hand over the last 22 years, 4:30 AM to 6:30 AM have been be far the hottest times. Other times the night can be ice cold and if you can force yourself to turn in early which is almost impossible to do, you may make a killing early AM the next morning and so on. Could all be coincidence, but I am talking about a time period of over 2 decades and 2-3 visits a week and more millions of hands than I can count.

[DaBurglar]

Just to add: As we know, Illinois is one screwed up state very much in need of additional revenue. But, if the state is so strapped for cash then why is there resistance toward expanding casino gambling in the state? Notes1 touched on one of the main reasons to answer this valid question, so I will expand on it using my own state's recent experiences (Massachusetts).....There are MANY people who hate gambling and are very active in their opposition, so in states like Illinois or Massachusetts, they only approve very limited amounts and forms of gambling to appease both sides of the issue (the pro gaming/revenue side   and  the anti gaming/moral majority side.)Many people still think gambling is at the very least a harmful vice, at the most outright EVIL and immoral, and these people tend to be very active politically (i.e. they VOTE.....EARLY and OFTEN )    Where as people who tend to favor gaming are also tending to be politically apathetic or even LAZY, meaning they do not vote nearly as much.....at least this is what recent studies in Massachusetts seemed to reveal!     In fact people who DO vote and also happen to favor gaming do so NOT because they themselves want to go out and GAMBLE, but they want the promised REVENUE and JOBS the casino(s) might bring.     The Gamblers themselves tend to be lazy or are too busy gambling to VOTE  lol But either way, Notes1 also hit upon the education factor......in Illinois as in Massachusetts, there is a large constituency of highly educated voters who are politically active.    Therefore, there will be enough actual LEGISLATORS in the state governments to either OPPOSE or LIMIT the expansion of gaming, no matter HOW bad the revenue situation becomes.That answers Ted's question nicely I believe

[DaBurglar]

   

Daburglar:

Sorry buddy, I admit nothing. If you read my post carefully I simply say that it's a possibility. I also say that it might just be random and will go away at some point. At the current time I probably weigh either possibility as 50/50. I do not possess enough information to make an informed opinion yet I believe I have enough education on the matter to make give possible reasons for what we see happening. I'm simply not smart enough to say with any certainty that manipulation (of any sort) is actually happening.

I will say one thing. My current status of "losing" is basically the casinos money right now as I'm really only playing their comps at this point. I've limited my own money to 50 dollars per visit. They are still giving me 2,200/month to play with. When that will run out who knows. I expected FEB, but it still came. I expected March, but it still came. They give, I play. I'm sure their profit center of 50/week from Roveer won't support the 2.2k/month comp for very long. In addition I've received over a thousand dollars in gift cards, TV's and other crap gadgets since January so they are still being pretty generous. That soon will end.

Everyone is of their own free mind to think what they want. We all process the information differently. At this point I can't make a definitive decision that the possibilities that I put forth are in fact happening. I guess we are just going to have to join the ranks of UFO's. So much information, yet still no definitive proof.

RoveerOk well no need to be sorry....but you did "word" your dissertation in such a way and to such a degree (you clearly say it is 50/50) that it is easy to conclude that you believe something is amiss AT LEAST in the SHORT run, and since most of us only play a few hours at a time, the proverbial "Short Run/term" is the exact definition of how we are playing!  Therefore, WHATEVER is going on is obviously impacting us and our results directly.....I'm not going to hold you to anything, and you are correct, we all have a right to think and conclude what we want......it is just that, in my case, it seems that when I exercise this right it pisses certain posters named Tedlark off! And I assumed that when you said "your miserable play as of late" you were conceding that you are in fact, losing in terms of overall play results......you only mentioned your 200 monthly free play allowance in your followup........so that was just a misunderstanding.

[Tedlark]

[QUOTE=Tedlark] Just to add: As we know, Illinois is one screwed up state very much in need of additional revenue. But, if the state is so strapped for cash then why is there resistance toward expanding casino gambling in the state? Notes1 touched on one of the main reasons to answer this valid question, so I will expand on it using my own state's recent experiences (Massachusetts).....There are MANY people who hate gambling and are very active in their opposition, so in states like Illinois or Massachusetts, they only approve very limited amounts and forms of gambling to appease both sides of the issue (the pro gaming/revenue side   and  the anti gaming/moral majority side.)Many people still think gambling is at the very least a harmful vice, at the most outright EVIL and immoral, and these people tend to be very active politically (i.e. they VOTE.....EARLY and OFTEN )    Where as people who tend to favor gaming are also tending to be politically apathetic or even LAZY, meaning they do not vote nearly as much.....at least this is what recent studies in Massachusetts seemed to reveal!     In fact people who DO vote and also happen to favor gaming do so NOT because they themselves want to go out and GAMBLE, but they want the promised REVENUE and JOBS the casino(s) might bring.     The Gamblers themselves tend to be lazy or are too busy gambling to VOTE  lol But either way, Notes1 also hit upon the education factor......in Illinois as in Massachusetts, there is a large constituency of highly educated voters who are politically active.    Therefore, there will be enough actual LEGISLATORS in the state governments to either OPPOSE or LIMIT the expansion of gaming, no matter HOW bad the revenue situation becomes.That answers Ted's question nicely I believe[/QUOTE]
   You are not quite right DaBurglar. Prior to Rep. Rita taking up the charge for a gambling expansion his predessesor got a casino expansion bill passed only to be vetoed by the then Governor. This was when the Illinois legislature was controled by the democrats at the same time there was a democratic Governor.