Major mistake?

[Tedlark]

notes the moral to your story is this: "if it ain't broke, don't fix it."   If we're winning and got to the championship while being "under the weather" then that's the way we're used to playing.

P.S. I still won't hold the kicker.....lol.

[damule]

Made another trip to the casino and like usual I was down from the start. The only thing different by this trip was I couldn't even hit a full house and had only 2 flushes playing $1 DDB, usually I'm getting a little play but this time I was already down $900. I switch to $1 TDB and lose another $200, not one single flush or full house did manage to catch a straight when I was ready to quit, last push I was dealt, "K,A,A,3,A". I know the correct hold was to keep the 3 but I was getting killed and the $800 would get ne back in the game. I throw away the 3 and first card on the deal was Ace, second card King. Take my $800 and quit for the day because I'm to mad at myself to continue.

100% I would have done the same thing. First off, the RNG is still spinning until you hit the draw button, so it's very unlikely you would have pulled the same card (Ace) if you held the kicker. Plus, like Tedlark said, there's another 11 kickers left in the deck, so the $4k pay out is still in play. Kickers are great, but you have to hit the quad first. How bad would you have felt if you ended up with just the $10 payout? Unless you're going to play millions and millions of hands you're never going to gain the long term benefit of holding the kicker (Quick Quad games excluded with certain hands). If my bankroll is endless, sure, why not hold the kicker. But most recreational players are trying to manage their bankroll per session. You ended up a few hundred down instead of over a grand. That's how I would view it. You lived to play another day.

[OTABILL]

I haven't played TDB often at a casino. When I do so, I don't hold the kicker. Usually I stick with single line DDB. To me the DDB equivalents are holding three aces rather than a full house and a high pair rather than three to a royal. In the 10 years I have played DDB prior to our sabbatical earlier this year, playing the correct mathematical hand killed me. For example, never got 4 aces after breaking up Aces full. Missed three RF holding a K,Q,J high pair rather than three to a royal. Dealt 4 to a royal in 10 years, only 1 time 6 or 7 years ago did I get a RF. While I never counted the number of hands played, understand that for many years we would play at least once a week for 6-8 hours at a time. Years ago, despite the above, we did well playing inferior paytables locally than when we went to Vegas/Laughlin with its much better paytables. To reiterate, after 10 years luck has outweighed math big time for me. I am convinced, if Dancer had my luck playing VP he would never have survived regardless of perfect play.

[markinca]

The hint you've provided was very intriguing. I had to look it up and find out that the winner is AAA+Kicker.

Shouldn't really even need to look it up to know AAA+K is much better than AQJT suited.

With AAA+k suited, you have 1 out to 4000 credits, 3 outs to ~45 credits, and basically 43 outs for 10 credits.

With AQJT suited, you have 1 out to 4000 credits, 8 outs to ~30 credits, 3 outs to 20 credits, and 9 outs to 5 credits.

[notes1]

   notes the moral to your story is this: "if it ain't broke, don't fix it."   If we're winning and got to the championship while being "under the weather" then that's the way we're used to playing.

P.S. I still won't hold the kicker.....lol.

'under the weather', is that the PC version of a hangover?

p.s., I agree

[alpax]

[QUOTE=alpax]
The hint you've provided was very intriguing. I had to look it up and find out that the winner is AAA+Kicker.

Shouldn't really even need to look it up to know AAA+K is much better than AQJT suited.

With AAA+k suited, you have 1 out to 4000 credits, 3 outs to ~45 credits, and basically 43 outs for 10 credits.

With AQJT suited, you have 1 out to 4000 credits, 8 outs to ~30 credits, 3 outs to 20 credits, and 9 outs to 5 credits. [/QUOTE]

I am not used to thinking about the trips and the kicker situation since I normally play Jacks or Better for real money wagers. I do not need to have large winning days to be satisfied with video poker.

The best four to the Royal is King-Queen-Jack-Ten is for sure since it is an open ended straight draw.

I believe in my opinion is that Vman was trying to get at the fact most people will go for the Royal Flush even if they were dealt a paying high pair, straight, or a flush when 4 of the cards make up a Royal. The EV is high enough to warrant going for it.

Yet with trip aces and a kicker which has a higher EV and more incentive to go for that one card, some people will lower their EV and think they will hedge their bet by getting increased chances at 4 Aces.

For you to be able to calculate the outs like that, and based on what you posted before that. I added you to my mental list of the highly competent players on this site. I promised I would not mention names to someone.

Training software and GOLD membership on this site will easily flag not holding the kicker as a Red level error. If I make a Red level error on any game, I would cancel my trip to the casino.

[notes1]

as far as giving 'misinformation', there is a big difference between, when asked, how one would play a hand with their own money, under a certain situation, and telling one what the correct play is.

seems those who play a lot, with real money and often report their results, are more inclined to take a bird in the hand instead of two in the bush.

[markinca]

as far as giving 'misinformation', there is a big difference between, when asked, how one would play a hand with their own money, under a certain situation, and telling one what the correct play is.

seems those who play a lot, with real money and often report their results, are more inclined to take a bird in the hand instead of two in the bush.



I think what people are trying to say in this thread is that if you're dealt AAA+kicker, but if your session is bad enough you'll get gunshy and just keep AAA, then why are you even playing TDB to begin with?

If there are circumstances where you're going to willingly pass up the correct play for more credits in favor of an incorrect play for a safer shot at less credits, then don't play TDB - just stick with DDB.

[olds442jetaway]

I haven't played TDB often at a casino. When I do so, I don't hold the kicker. Usually I stick with single line DDB. To me the DDB equivalents are holding three aces rather than a full house and a high pair rather than three to a royal. In the 10 years I have played DDB prior to our sabbatical earlier this year, playing the correct mathematical hand killed me. For example, never got 4 aces after breaking up Aces full. Missed three RF holding a K,Q,J high pair rather than three to a royal. Dealt 4 to a royal in 10 years, only 1 time 6 or 7 years ago did I get a RF. While I never counted the number of hands played, understand that for many years we would play at least once a week for 6-8 hours at a time. Years ago, despite the above, we did well playing inferior paytables locally than when we went to Vegas/Laughlin with its much better paytables. To reiterate, after 10 years luck has outweighed math big time for me. I am convinced, if Dancer had my luck playing VP he would never have survived regardless of perfect play.

     OTB you just may be my 2nd customer after Fla Phil for my new book which will if written be titled " Video Poker. Its all about luck. And how to make your own luck"

[notes1]

in the scenario presented by the original poster, were the odds increased to essentially break even by drawing 1 or 2 cards?

gunshy or practical?

does theoretical always equate to reality?