Difference between a pro and recreational gambler

[FloridaPhil]

[quote=pokerforme]I don't know everything he does to make a living at VP but over the
years he has painted a good picture of how he is working the casino
system.[/quote] Very true.  You can learn a lot from his posts even if you don't agree with his strategies or the way he makes his living.   I do not envy professional video poker players one bit, but I want to be able to use their tactics to advantage my own play as much as possible.  Listening to other people's ideas is a good thing as long as you keep your own situation in mind before adopting them for yourself.

[pokerforme]

[quote=pokerforme]I don't know everything he does to make a living at VP but over the
years he has painted a good picture of how he is working the casino
system. Very true.  You can learn a lot from his posts even if you don't agree with his strategies or the way he makes his living.   I do not envy professional video poker players one bit, but I want to be able to use their tactics to advantage my own play as much as possible.  Listening to other people's ideas is a good thing as long as you keep your own situation in mind before adopting them for yourself.

I agree completely. Every time someone on this forum posts a new idea people here are willing to show the math, try it, use it as they see fit....trial and error right before your eyes. And any time I enter the casino I use all of these ideas, but in a way that fits me or the casino I am in. Your cheap system is a example of that.

[/QUOTE]

[Mr.Dawes]

It does have the drawing back of "heartbreak" when you get that one-coin royal. You may be well-equipped to deal with that, FP, but I assure you many players aren't.When Mr. Dancer mentions the pain of a single coin Royal it brings to mind one of the reasons why I sometimes deviate from perfect play. I first began to study DDB before a trip to Vegas last year where I would be playing .25 10/6 DDB at The Palms. When I returned home the best available paytable that I could find in Biloxi, my closest option, was 9/5 DDB. When I began to study the strategy changes I came across one that bothered me. Three to a Royal and a pair of non-Ace face cards. Due to the reduction in the flush payout from 6 to 5 the correct play becomes the pair of face cards instead of three to a Royal. Ex. Jd, Qd, Kd, Kh, 6S ( and its equivalent hands). The e.v. for K, K is 7.23 and Jd, Qd, Kd is 7.146. On quarter max coin this is a difference of 2 cents. I could not convince myself to discard three to a royal in favor of a pair of kings for 2 cents. If I ever held the kings and drew the Ad, 10d I would be distraught for weeks, maybe longer. I choose to see this 2 cents not as lost e.v. but as a payment on an insurance policy against the pain of a missed Royal.To Mr. Dancer’s original topic, I think this highlights a difference between the pro and recreational player. I play 40 to 60 thousand hands a year where a pro may play that many in a week or even a day. The pro knows over time he will win more simply by choosing the higher e.v. As a casual player I don’t think I will experience this hand often enough to lose a significant percent of my bankroll, but if I should hit that 1 in 1,081 draw for that royal it would have a significant impact on my bankroll.

[misterlister]

Some of you just don't like Bob. Yea he comes off pretty bad at times, and even I become offended by some of the way he says things. On the flip side he also does this for FREE.

Liking or not has nothing to do with it. Just trying to make sense of his claims and very little of them add up.

He does this for FREE? What is "this"? Ask him for help and he'll ask for your credit card.

[Mr.Dawes]

[QUOTE=pokerforme] Some of you just don't like Bob. Yea he comes off pretty bad at times, and even I become offended by some of the way he says things. On the flip side he also does this for FREE.

Liking or not has nothing to do with it. Just trying to make sense of his claims and very little of them add up.

He does this for FREE? What is "this"? Ask him for help and he'll ask for your credit card. [/QUOTE]Actually, I emailed Bob Dancer with a video poker question once and he very politely answered my question and asked me for nothing in return.

[notes1]

omt, i/m/o, this is a flawed accounting system. one could delay realizing actual real dollar losses, as long as there are free play offers available.  even as a small time player, i have thousands of dollars of free play available at a variety of casinos, of which, i will never use 90% of those offers. but, using your system, as long as i have offers, i could use those 'potential' dollars to offset the loss of actual real money.  this subject came up because dancer stated he counted free play toward his net results. imagine, at the level he plays, the amount of free play he has available.  one might consider free play as a reward for paying at a casino, but it is also an enticement to return and lose even more money.

[misterlister]

[/QUOTE]Actually, I emailed Bob Dancer with a video poker question once and he very politely answered my question and asked me for nothing in return.

I had a different experience. I asked him several questions after attending his class and purchasing his software, and he very politely said his services were at the rate of $250/hour.   

[gregorio]

[QUOTE=Mr.Dawes]Actually, I emailed Bob Dancer with a video poker question once and he very politely answered my question and asked me for nothing in return. [/QUOTE]

I had a different experience. I asked him several questions after attending his class and purchasing his software, and he very politely said his services were at the rate of $250/hour.   [/QUOTE]Wow! His price went up. I had a similar experience with Mr. Dancer in 2009, but after I spent $400 for a 2-hour private conversation with him in my hotel room in Vegas. I e-mailed him with an observation and asked  for his comment. His response was and I quote:" If you wish to debate this in person at $200 an hour, let me know. Im not interested in an email pen pal. Sorry. Bob Dancer" .  I am a fairly well known expert in a non-gambling field and I dispense my advice freely and love to do it. If I answered any of them in the same manner Bob did, I'd have zero inquiries and my expertise wouldn't be worth a penny!

[alpax]

Mr. Dancer's price for private services (minimum of 2 hours) did go up from the past.

Post to special offer rate in 2013

[FloridaPhil]

I think $250 an hour is cheap if you make or save money from his knowledge.  Have you had to hire a lawyer or a cardiologist lately?  How much money did you make from that experience?  I don't know why anyone would hire him anyway.  Everything you need to know is detailed in his books, on his show or in his software.  I've never met him but I've emailed him before and was surprised that he answered me.  Dancer is Dancer and I kind of enjoy his wit.   He can get under your skin if you let him, but I think he enjoys that a little.