Shutting down "hottt" machines??

[DaBurglar]

I borrowed the following Picture from one of SPXCHROME's posts in order to better illustrate my following post and the question/issue I want to discuss ....... although I also thought about using Billyjoe's now-famous "DEALT ROYAL" for $64,000 on a DOUBLE PAY 5 star game, I think this picture is slightly better for the topic I am highlighting.....

this is just plain FRIGHTENING!!!!     I am serious!        Scary X 100First
off, I know I will never EVER hit that because I can barely tolerate
playing 5 line games at 25 cents max bet....to be taking shots at 100
lines, @ 25 cents with max bet just gives me the heebie jeebies!    Secondly, with all my chickensh*t playing aside ()
.......I have to believe that the particular machine SPXCHROME
witnessed this hit taking place was most likely UNPLUGGED immediately
after and either audited, or had a chip changed or
something......casinos usually react in some way, shape or form when
they suffer a grievous hit like this, no matter how infinitesimal the
chance(s) of it happening the first time, let alone again...... Now, a single $100K hit on a machine
seems like a fart in the wind in the grand scheme of things TO THE AVERAGE CASINO, and
generally it is....but how many of us have seen something like that?
----->    Where a machine (Video Poker machine, but could also be a
slot machine if applicable) gets hit for some unbelievable amount, and
is promptly "turned off" for maintenance or some other thing?   in
Late 2011, I saw a VP machine at RESORTS-AC in the "old high limit area
prior to the latest renovation" actually get turned off after a guy hit
a Royal for $20,000 playing $5 credits....I later learned from both the
lucky recipient and his "hand payer" that the same machine had
previously spit out two other hand pay royals that same day for $8000
apiece (different players though, playing $2 credits)!   These two
smaller royals happened about 8 hours earlier prior to the $20k royal,
and there was less than 2 hours between each $8K royal!   How many hands
played that encompassed the total time period amongst all these royals I
could not tell you, but since that area in Resorts-AC was previously
WELL secluded and off the beaten path, I cannot imagine the total number
of hands was appreciable!        This machine DESERVED to die!  LOL!!!

[olds442jetaway]

I have seen it done at Mohegan, but not too recently. Probably because there are so few hand pays nowdays.

[rascal]

No. Not true at most casinos that I am aware of. I have someone in my family who is in top casino management so I know of what I speak.

For the average player playing average denominations ($.25 through $5, extreme luck makes no difference to the casino. Casinos place machines on an annual basis and management understands that it can take up to a year for a machine to reach the ER vs AR average. When a machine has been in place for exactly a year its ER vs AR average is computed and "adjustments", if necessary, are then made.

The average denomination vp machine in the average casino cycles through, very roughly, somewhere between $1 million and $3 million annually, paying out, very roughly, somewhere between $800,000 and $2.6 million. Some machines are much higher, depending on floor traffic, and of course some are much lower. Point being, ten royals on a given day are not going to cause any panic, although eyebrows might be raised at such extreme luck. It's what the machine does during the course of a calendar year that counts.

Three disclaimers: a) Obviously, if a machine is consistently losing very badly even before the one year cycle is up, the casino might jump in sooner --- but this would be over a long period of time, not one or two bad days. b) Certain very high denomination machines, i.e. $100, are exposed to more frequent ER vs AR scrutiny than are the lower denominations. c) My comments are restricted to slot management's decisions about machines in terms of ER vs AR -- obviously, if security has a concern about how one particular jackpot was won then that's a whole 'nother can of worms and might result in a machine being changed or shut down by security, not slot management.

But for the average player playing average denominations, the casino is not going to react impulsively at one or two day's action --- it is the ER vs AR of the machine over a calendar year that counts.

(VP players, when possible, should look at their own won-loss record the same way --- results over the long haul, not a few bad days.)

[Minn. Fatz]

I think if I were owning a casino and one of my VP machines produced three RFs in a day I'd want to take a look at it, too, if only to see how many hands got played on the thing. I'd be less likely to unplug one machine for delivering one RF, no matter how "costly." Recall that expected return figures include the rare RF, so that machine is generating theoretical revenue for the casino on every hand that's played.

[Tedlark]

Some observations: 1) excellent post rascal; 2) after my biggest one time hit of $15,000.00 the machine received a once over before being put back into play; 3) Hollywood Casino in Joliet, IL had two DreamCard machines for a very short period of time (under 60 days) before they were removed from the casino. What caused them to be removed? It wasn't from inactivity as they were always in use so this would lead me to believe something else involving return caused them to be taken out.

[onemoretry]

When a machine has been in place for exactly a year its ER vs AR average is computed and "adjustments", if necessary, are then made.


What kind of "adjustments"?

[DaBurglar]

No. Not true at most casinos that I am aware of. I have someone in my family who is in top casino management so I know of what I speak.
content-content-content-content-etc(VP players, when possible, should look at their own won-loss record the same way --- results over the long haul, not a few bad days.)VERY Interesting overall post rascal....! Can you tell us WHICH casino your family member is in top management, or at the very least, which MARKET he works (i.e. Vegas, or Reno, or AC, or....???) I have seen this action happen a few times, although admittedly NOT very often, so I cant totally accept your statement of "No, not true at most casinos" but I will agree with you that it is not too common an occurrence.     But, as I was thinking back even further, about a year ago in Caesars-AC, on a wheel of fortune slot progressive I saw a lady hit for $178,000 as I was wheeling out the door....she had a huge crowd around her of the usual characters so after congratulating her, I split.  When I returned not even 30 minutes late, the machine was dark with a "out of order" sign on it.....From what Tedlark shared, I dare say that he is ALSO describing Dreamcard machines being removed because the casino does not LIKE the positive results they are yielding to customers, and while Dreamcard is extremely volatile and can eat bankrolls like Godzilla eats Toyotas, I know from my own experience that dreamcard can be a extremely STREAKY, and IF a player gets hott playing Dreamcard multiline, look out!!

[rascal]

ToONEMORETRY:

Adjustments generally fall into four categories:

1. Change the paytable, by far the most common.

2. Move the machine. An end of row machine might be moved to the center of the row and vice versa. Changing position frequently results in changed AR.

3. On machines with multiple games, remove the unprofitable game.

4. Remove the machine from the inventory.

(As to #2 above, here is a funny but true story. At a Laughlin casino, a regular had a favorite VP machine that he played almost daily, calling it his "Baby" and insisting that he was always ahead. One night slot management realigned the machines in an area and "Baby" was moved a short distance away and given a new denom and new paytable. A different machine took its place with the same denom and paytable "Baby" had previously. The regular continued to play the new machine and continued to comment to slot attendants how that machine loved him, he had mastered it, etc etc etc.)

[rascal]

[QUOTE=rascal]No. Not true at most casinos that I am aware of. I have someone in my family who is in top casino management so I know of what I speak.
content-content-content-content-etc(VP players, when possible, should look at their own won-loss record the same way --- results over the long haul, not a few bad days.)VERY Interesting overall post rascal....! Can you tell us WHICH casino your family member is in top management, or at the very least, which MARKET he works (i.e. Vegas, or Reno, or AC, or....???) I have seen this action happen a few times, although admittedly NOT very often, so I cant totally accept your statement of "No, not true at most casinos" but I will agree with you that it is not too common an occurrence.     But, as I was thinking back even further, about a year ago in Caesars-AC, on a wheel of fortune slot progressive I saw a lady hit for $178,000 as I was wheeling out the door....she had a huge crowd around her of the usual characters so after congratulating her, I split.  When I returned not even 30 minutes late, the machine was dark with a "out of order" sign on it.....From what Tedlark shared, I dare say that he is ALSO describing Dreamcard machines being removed because the casino does not LIKE the positive results they are yielding to customers, and while Dreamcard is extremely volatile and can eat bankrolls like Godzilla eats Toyotas, I know from my own experience that dreamcard can be a extremely STREAKY, and IF a player gets hott playing Dreamcard multiline, look out!!
[/QUOTE]

Vegas/Laughlin

She, not he

Now with corporate and not a single casino

[Vman96]

Funny story about "Baby", rascal. And yeah yearly sounds about right for most casinos I have visited to "shake things up", but it just depends. My two local casinos have made very few changes in the past 2 years or so. Considering they have the best quarters in town, I'm cool with that.