legitimate vp question

[katipug]

ok, here it is, my husband is always fussing at me for holding like say  K-10 suited (Im always chasing the royal) instead of K/J or Q not suited. I would feel terrible if I drew 3 more to the royal and had not held the 10. Am I really losing alot more this way? Please advise all you pro's and numbers crunchers, is this a "gut feeling thing" or should I play the stats?  kati                                                                                                                                                             

[xswansong]

Kati, I always hold the suited K-10. It might not be the right move according to the experts, but hey, I'm a gambler

[katipug]

me too, swan, I held 1 card once and got a royal, you just never know

[royal flush]

you lose some value and your long term return will drop/ think of it this way your short term bankroll will be exausted faster missing the pair of jacks or queens which will keep you playing the machine longer and as long as you are playing you might hit the royal

[xswansong]

Very true royal, but I agree with Kati, I've hit more royals holding 1 or 2 cards than I have getting dealt 4 to royal. I look at it this way, it's your money, play however you are comfortable. I for one play for fun, and there is nothing more fun than seeing those 5 suited beauty's pop up.

[doris13]

kati,i always hold the 10.can't hit the royal without it

[New2vp]

Am I really losing alot more this way? Please advise all you pro's and numbers crunchers, is this a "gut feeling thing" or should I play the stats?  kati            No advice, just some statistics.  If you move JT, QT, and KT suited ahead above all the 2-high-card unsuited holds on a basic strategy chart , you will have an expected loss of 0.77 coins per hour.  That is enough information to make the decision for most that are inclined to "go for it" since that's chicken feed...and gambling and hitting royals is what it's all about, right?0.77 coins is hardly anything but that means during the the non-royal hours, you will lose whatever extra royals you hit (at 4000 coins each) in addition to this loss.  That works out to about an extra 3.43 coins per hour compared to what you would make using basic strategy.  You should hit a royal on average once per 65 hours.  If your royals appear like clockwork, you'll make up most of that 3.43-coin loss per hour so that your overall loss over basic strategy during each 65-hour period will be about 50 coins.Now, let's see what you get for your trouble.  More frequent royals!  If you play 40 hours per week, you will get an extra 0.0267 royals per week.  So after a short 37 1/2 weeks, you can expect to get one more royal than if you played basic strategy!  And with the extra royal offsetting some of your losses, you can expect an overall additional loss during that time of only 1150 coins, about 29% of that extra royal.  So, that extra royal has cost 1.29 royals.Bigger losses, more frequent wins.  Math has an answer for some questions but not for those with personal preferences that an individual is unwilling or unable to express numerically.  Maximize expected value?  There is no question as to the correct play.  Increase the chances at hitting royals?  A different answer, but then we get to one of degree.  Should you keep KT suited over KT9 suited?  How about a 4-card flush draw?  Increasing your fun at an affordable rate for you?  Be happy with your personal answer (unless you want to change it) but don't expect universal agreement or acceptance.

[Quad Deuces]

kati -To get a real answer you'll need to give us more information.  What game at what pay table?For example, in 9/6 Jacks or Better, it depends.  If you're dealt KcTc7h3c8d you hold the KT.  If you are dealt KcTc7h3c9d you hold just the K.In the first hand, discarding the 3c reduces your chance to make a flush, since there is one fewer club in the stock to fill out your hand.  In the second hand, the 3c reduces your chance to make a flush AND the 9d reduces your chances to make a straight.  These two combine to make holding KT less valuable than the K alone drawing 4 cards instead of just 3.  In this case, the 3c would be called a flush penalty and the 9d a straight penalty.If you research further, you will find that holding K-high and A-high 2-card royal draws are different in every game if you want to play perfectly.

[Quad Deuces]

Kati, I always hold the suited K-10. It might not be the right move according to the experts, but hey, I'm a gamblerDo you also hold A-10??

[katipug]

Hi Quad,  no I always hold an ace, no ace-t.  And I usually am playing DDB, TDB. Lots of great answers, really wanted to get an idea of the stats, thank you all so much for taking time to answer me. Im just a recreational player, usually .25 denom.   kati