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What is your concern about "2 or 3?"
All that is saying is that the game can't have hidden information that makes it impossible to determine an optimal strategy.
They either have to give you the strategy, or provide enough information (like a visible pay table) to derive the strategy on your own.
In slots, I'd say the "strategy" is given to you. Push a button and the rng will determine payouts in a manner that would arrive at the RTP over the long term.
In video poker, you need the pay tables in order to make holds that will arrive at the RTP. Playing improper strategy will arrive at a lower RTP as it should, which is why people take the time to learn proper strategy and maximize their return. This is also why casinos can offer video poker with a higher RTP than slots, knowing most players do not achieve it.
Not so fast... AC may in fact be rigged (legally)
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Eduardo
- Video Poker Master
- Posts: 2963
- Joined: Thu Aug 31, 2006 7:19 pm
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shadowman
- Video Poker Master
- Posts: 3587
- Joined: Mon Oct 23, 2006 5:42 pm
I agree with Eduardo, the regulations appear to imply that the machines MUST return the optimal strategy ER if that strategy is used. In other words, no cheating.
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DaBurglar
- Video Poker Master
- Posts: 4535
- Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2011 12:11 pm
nah thats not right when you guys go to AC and then return and post pics of all your super huge wins, then I'll listen
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Eduardo
- Video Poker Master
- Posts: 2963
- Joined: Thu Aug 31, 2006 7:19 pm
I'm not saying anything about results, just what those posted regulations mean. If you disagree with what I think they say, please explain.
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BillyJoe
- Video Poker Master
- Posts: 3198
- Joined: Sat Aug 23, 2008 2:00 pm
[QUOTE=billyjoe] Hmmm... found this in the CURRENT NJ Gaming Regs...
<FONT face=Calibri-Bold-Identity-H>
13:69E1.28A Standards for the approval of a slot machine game<FONT face=Calibri-Identity-H>
(a) Except as otherwise provided in this section, each slot machine game which requires a wager shall have a theoretical return to player (RTP) equal to or greater than 83 percent.
<FONT face=Calibri-Identity-H>
(g) A slot machine game that requires skilled strategy choices, such as video poker, shall:
1. Have its theoretical RTP calculated based upon the player exercising optimal strategy during game play;
2. Disclose optimal strategy to achieve the highest theoretical RTP; or
3. Provide mathematically sufficient information for the patron to derive optimal strategy in order to achieve the highest theoretical RTP.
Are these regs on-line or do we need to go to the CCC to get them?
Those statements are pretty vague and create more questions than answers. I can o ly imagine what the complete regs say but I have a feeling that I'll be reading them soon enough. [/QUOTE]
I got them online, Roveer. Make sure, though, that you are looking at the ones that start with "13", as those are the 2013 versions. There are also other years out on the Web.
The total regs are quite lengthy, and you are right, I am not positive what that means. I only copied a small part, but I was surprised to see that Video Poker was referred to as a "skilled slot machine". If they are referring to the pay tables for VP, then I don't know why the regs just don't say that.
<FONT face=Calibri-Bold-Identity-H>
13:69E1.28A Standards for the approval of a slot machine game<FONT face=Calibri-Identity-H>
(a) Except as otherwise provided in this section, each slot machine game which requires a wager shall have a theoretical return to player (RTP) equal to or greater than 83 percent.
<FONT face=Calibri-Identity-H>
(g) A slot machine game that requires skilled strategy choices, such as video poker, shall:
1. Have its theoretical RTP calculated based upon the player exercising optimal strategy during game play;
2. Disclose optimal strategy to achieve the highest theoretical RTP; or
3. Provide mathematically sufficient information for the patron to derive optimal strategy in order to achieve the highest theoretical RTP.
Are these regs on-line or do we need to go to the CCC to get them?
Those statements are pretty vague and create more questions than answers. I can o ly imagine what the complete regs say but I have a feeling that I'll be reading them soon enough. [/QUOTE]
I got them online, Roveer. Make sure, though, that you are looking at the ones that start with "13", as those are the 2013 versions. There are also other years out on the Web.
The total regs are quite lengthy, and you are right, I am not positive what that means. I only copied a small part, but I was surprised to see that Video Poker was referred to as a "skilled slot machine". If they are referring to the pay tables for VP, then I don't know why the regs just don't say that.
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faygo
- Video Poker Master
- Posts: 2925
- Joined: Tue Jan 09, 2007 6:55 am
What is your concern about "2 or 3?"
All that is saying is that the game can't have hidden information that makes it impossible to determine an optimal strategy.
They either have to give you the strategy, or provide enough information (like a visible pay table) to derive the strategy on your own.
In slots, I'd say the "strategy" is given to you. Push a button and the rng will determine payouts in a manner that would arrive at the RTP over the long term.
In video poker, you need the pay tables in order to make holds that will arrive at the RTP. Playing improper strategy will arrive at a lower RTP as it should, which is why people take the time to learn proper strategy and maximize their return. This is also why casinos can offer video poker with a higher RTP than slots, knowing most players do not achieve it.
Nice try Eduardo. People will just believe what they want to. I swear I saw an alien spaceship last night. Don't tell me I didn't.
All that is saying is that the game can't have hidden information that makes it impossible to determine an optimal strategy.
They either have to give you the strategy, or provide enough information (like a visible pay table) to derive the strategy on your own.
In slots, I'd say the "strategy" is given to you. Push a button and the rng will determine payouts in a manner that would arrive at the RTP over the long term.
In video poker, you need the pay tables in order to make holds that will arrive at the RTP. Playing improper strategy will arrive at a lower RTP as it should, which is why people take the time to learn proper strategy and maximize their return. This is also why casinos can offer video poker with a higher RTP than slots, knowing most players do not achieve it.
Nice try Eduardo. People will just believe what they want to. I swear I saw an alien spaceship last night. Don't tell me I didn't.
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EDC1977
- Video Poker Master
- Posts: 2001
- Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2007 3:12 pm
Does this apply to a martingale system also?
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DaBurglar
- Video Poker Master
- Posts: 4535
- Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2011 12:11 pm
Nice try Eduardo. People will just believe what they want to. I swear I saw an alien spaceship last night. Don't tell me I didn't.
Well there you have it folks.....The concept of human beings succumbing to greed, fear for their jobs, and plain old mischief and actaully rigging MACHINES is akin to Aliens landing in someone's backyard in spaceships. Well f*** me.....
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roveer
- Senior Member
- Posts: 458
- Joined: Mon Oct 09, 2006 1:20 am
I spoke to an insider yesturday that told me that the game chips are jurisdiction specific. I'll verify this once I've seen them for myself. "In fact the various base chips in the
machines usually will have the a two letter identifier for the jurisdiction
such as NJ, AZ, NV"
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faygo
- Video Poker Master
- Posts: 2925
- Joined: Tue Jan 09, 2007 6:55 am
[QUOTE=faygo]
Nice try Eduardo. People will just believe what they want to. I swear I saw an alien spaceship last night. Don't tell me I didn't.
Well there you have it folks.....The concept of human beings succumbing to greed, fear for their jobs, and plain old mischief and actaully rigging MACHINES is akin to Aliens landing in someone's backyard in spaceships. Well f*** me.....[/QUOTE]
When you get around to proving something and have advised authorities. let us know. Insinuating that people are cheats is not helpful to any one.
Nice try Eduardo. People will just believe what they want to. I swear I saw an alien spaceship last night. Don't tell me I didn't.
Well there you have it folks.....The concept of human beings succumbing to greed, fear for their jobs, and plain old mischief and actaully rigging MACHINES is akin to Aliens landing in someone's backyard in spaceships. Well f*** me.....[/QUOTE]
When you get around to proving something and have advised authorities. let us know. Insinuating that people are cheats is not helpful to any one.
