Understanding NSUD Two Card Straight Flush Holds

[Vman96]

On the games from this website, since the buttons are a keyboard, I can play over 1000 hands an hour, but I still make errors from playing too quick. My mistakes are costly too. So every hand I double check to slow down the pace.



Yeah I can play about 1000/hr on a computer, but like you said, easier to make mistakes. And the type of mistakes you make by going too fast just one of them can easily wipe out a day's gains you made from knowing penalty card situations.

[Minn. Fatz]

Speaking of misplays, I've had a thread idea in my mind for awhile about how I feel worse about missing the right hold even if I suck out than making the right hold and missing. So I'm playing TDB for the monthly today and hold AA from AA22x, then the deal comes 22A for the FH...but I would've had a 800 credit quad had I held the deuces instead. Now I'm not so sure...

[alpax]

Speaking of misplays, I've had a thread idea in my mind for awhile about how I feel worse about missing the right hold even if I suck out than making the right hold and missing. So I'm playing TDB for the monthly today and hold AA from AA22x, then the deal comes 22A for the FH...but I would've had a 800 credit quad had I held the deuces instead. Now I'm not so sure...

4 2s, 3s, 4s w/ Any Ace,2,3,4 would pay out 2000 credits in TDB and 800 credits in DDB.

In your case, you made a much superior play by holding the aces since your expected return is over 1, meaning you are guaranteed at least your money back while going for 3 of a kind, full house, or Quads. Pair of deuces is not a guaranteed win although it has a higher ER in TDB than DDB

It happens time to time, I was dealt AA885, I kept the AA, but on the draw I got the other 2 8s for a two pair. Not much that can be done about that.

[BobDancer]

Post unable to migrate

[Minn. Fatz]

And in NSU you have some “reverse penalty cards,” like from an unsuited 2567T you hold 2567 and from a 2567K you hold the 2 by itself. Most players can’t figure out the “why” for this kind of problem by themselves, but the Winner’s Guides clearly explain it.

Would it be that since the T plays in more straight/SF hands than the K, the "power of the pack" (your term there) is that much less that holding the low straight draw with a deuce is best? Just a guess, not even back of the envelope stuff...

[quote]Clearly I’m a more serious player than many on this site are.[/quote]

Says the author of Million Dollar VP. Ya think?

[alpax]

I went ahead and bought a copy of Winners Guide for Deuces Wild. I was going to either get Million Dollar VP or VP for the Intelligent Beginner, but this Winners Guide probably would have more value to me as of right now.

I coin in about $10K during a play session on Deuces Wild, knowing these exceptions will squeeze in about a quarter per trip as compared with the Basic Strategy. I make a few mistakes during non-exception hands time to time, probably I can learn a few things with it.

The better part of this investment will come when learning the Airport Deuces paytable, I've already spent several hours with NSUD, and if I plan on going to the M Resort it will serve the most use there.

[BobDancer]

I coin in about $10K during a play session on Deuces Wild, knowing these exceptions will squeeze in about a quarter per trip as compared with the Basic Strategy. I make a few mistakes during non-exception hands time to time, probably I can learn a few things with it.

.Actually more like a quarter per session --- assuming you know basic strategy perfectly. That's a HUGE assumption.The fact of the matter is that players who do not learn the exceptions rarely know the basic strategy perfectly. Just the process of learning the penalty card situations causes you to review the basic strategy as you are practicing.Bob

[Vman96]

Just the process of learning the penalty card situations causes you to review the basic strategy as you are practicing.

A very good point I never really considered.

[alpax]

[QUOTE=alpax]I coin in about $10K during a play session on Deuces Wild, knowing these exceptions will squeeze in about a quarter per trip as compared with the Basic Strategy. I make a few mistakes during non-exception hands time to time, probably I can learn a few things with it.

.Actually more like a quarter per session --- assuming you know basic strategy perfectly. That's a HUGE assumption.The fact of the matter is that players who do not learn the exceptions rarely know the basic strategy perfectly. Just the process of learning the penalty card situations causes you to review the basic strategy as you are practicing.Bob[/QUOTE]

Thank you for the insight, I did derive the quarter per ten thousand dollar play from looking at the return from the Basic Strategy analysis (.997259) and the Optimal Strategy analysis (.997283). If you are dealt something good, it is usually to remember what to hold, but not so much with an ugly hand. Learning exceptions helps remember the priority order on the bottom end.

I do use a published strategy for now coming from the Wizard Of Odds site, so it is more simplified and probably returns less than the JB's analysis. I am losing out more than the quarter for sure.

I have not received the Winner's Guide as of this writing, but it is the next best thing if I am unable to attend your seminars at the SouthPoint.