cutting the losses

[Vman96]

Love Captain Obvious!

And as for the casino taxes, Nevada casinos have it really good. Too good if you ask me. That plus competition among other casinos help keep those paytables higher there, especially away from the Strip tourist trap.

[notes1]

vman, not sure i understand your statement about nevada casinos having it too good regarding casino taxes. taxes paid come from someplace, the consumer. in the case of casinos, that means players. that means more of our entertainment 'gambling' dollars are taken to fund worthy and many times unworthy projects, ala 'bridge to nowhere'. nevada needs to have as competitive a place to play,because it needs to attract visitors (30+ million /year) to a place no one in their right mind would ever want to go, the dessert. those casinos provide thousands of jobs to folks who likewise pay taxes and are not on the government dole.  the point i have unsuccesfully attempting to make is that outside of nevada and maybe a few others, the main reason that states are 'allowing; casinos in their jurisdiction, is for tax revenue. and we as players are paying for it. just read ted's post about the amount of taxes the ILL players have paid over the years. this adds to the reasons paytables and payouts have been reduced. i am no fan of casino owners, i have an interest in myself. and, that includes anything that costs me money. i might be beating a dead horse here, but i do not think that we are attributing enough credit to the increase cost of gambling, resulting from the cost that taxes have. 

[OTABILL]

just got back from 13 hour gambling session at cherokee. no premium hits, in the first 4 1/2 hours had one 4 of a kind, bled money. after the horrendous start, play was more as expected. lost a little more than half of my win from my last trip. overall, the loss was about in line with what i have been experiencing the last few years. nothing unexpected.  this was my 4th casino trip for 2015 and i will not be going to a casino until april. over the last few years, i would have gone 6 times per quarter. my goal for 2015 was to keep my casino losses within an acceptible amount. i do not want to bang away all day at JOB, play less than max coins or drive over 4 hours- hit my max loss limit after 4-6 hours and just drive all the way home. this my my answer to cutting the losses. the other fine ideas mentioned just do not work for me, at this time. less time playing equals less money loss. my losses have dropped. as informed players, i believe we almost have an obligation to show our displeasure with casino owners, with what has happened to the game we all enjoy so much. we can gripe about it, write letters of complaint, none of this will make a difference. you gotta hit them where they will notice....their wallet.     Â it was not that many years ago, domestic car makers had trouble selling their cars. not that long ago, it looked like best buy would fall victim to amazon. consumers mad them change or go out of business. i believe all gamblers can force some change. lose less money, whatever method works for you. force the closure of some casinos, reward those who take care of you and respect your loyalty.

I hear you and couldn't agree more regarding our experience. We have also had lousy results for the most part the past few years as compared to earlier times. The paytables on the machines we play have not changed, however the progressive meters have slowed. Additionally, the progressive bank we played frequently that were once solely DDB now is multi-game. For those reasons, we have decided to cut back drastically on playing VP, if not stopping altogether. I should add that this has occurred at local casinos and during trips to Vegas.

[Vman96]

vman, not sure i understand your statement about nevada casinos having it too good regarding casino taxes. taxes paid come from someplace, the consumer. in the case of casinos, that means players. that means more of our entertainment 'gambling' dollars are taken to fund worthy and many times unworthy projects, ala 'bridge to nowhere'. nevada needs to have as competitive a place to play,because it needs to attract visitors (30+ million /year) to a place no one in their right mind would ever want to go, the dessert. those casinos provide thousands of jobs to folks who likewise pay taxes and are not on the government dole.  the point i have unsuccesfully attempting to make is that outside of nevada and maybe a few others, the main reason that states are 'allowing; casinos in their jurisdiction, is for tax revenue. and we as players are paying for it. just read ted's post about the amount of taxes the ILL players have paid over the years. this adds to the reasons paytables and payouts have been reduced. i am no fan of casino owners, i have an interest in myself. and, that includes anything that costs me money. i might be beating a dead horse here, but i do not think that we are attributing enough credit to the increase cost of gambling, resulting from the cost that taxes have. 


I mostly was insinuating that taxes on Nevada casinos are too low and casinos get to keep a boatload of revenue as profit there. I get a little miffed when buying a Vegas show ticket has a higher percentage tax (10%) than the casino has to pay the state on its gaming revenue (6.75%).

Missouri is 23% on gaming revenue, fwiw. I personally think that's "fair". But excessive taxes on slots/VP as seen in PA (55%) and MD (67%!) also have major influence in suppressing VP paytables to poor paybacks. It's nearly impossible to find a game above 98% return there for quarters, or even dollars in those states.

[alpax]

Sorry to hear your story notes. The only way I responded to the casino greed was to cut a majority of play of slots for Jacks Or Better. I play the slots (authentic Aristocrat/WMS/IGT gmaes) on from the iPad now, despite that there is no thrill playing with fake money, it took a while to get used to.

If Harrah's Cherokee is the nearest, I've heard on Alan's Best Buy forums that the playable games are for the $5 denomination. It is unfortunate to be this way, not many have thousands of dollars to play with.

The local casinos will not go down here despite being tighter on slots and offering short pay VP, too many people willing to play virtually every penny and nickel slot machine that is offered on the casino floor. No empty seats on those during weekends despite it having the worst return. It has been going for years. On those Game King machines, too many people are willing to play Keno on them.

[notes1]

otabill and alpax, i/m/o, you are doing the right thing in response to lower paybacks from the machines. whether it is reduced play or only playing JOB, it is a response that will hurt the casinos revenue. every player who adjusts their play and gives the casino less is making their voice heard. it's like voting, with your wallet. just look at the number who are playing less than max, it is a growing number.  i recognize that most casinos are still busy on the weekends, but, they are 7 day a week, 24 hour a day operations, that cannot survive on weekend play only. i have heard/seen many stories around the country of machines sitting idle, due to lack of play.   sometimes doing the right thing in life doesn't always show immediate results. takes time, but we will see further casino closings. just look at AC- four closed, Tunica- in trouble, Ohio has a couple in trouble and i bet there are others.   as far as $5 machines, that is beyond my comfort zone.

[pokerforme]

Only problem I see with the "make them pay approach"...they seem more than happy to say ok VP is dead (we know its because of paytables etc) we will remove them machines and slide in MORE 1c machines that cost $1 plus a spin and pay out 30 dollars on super duper bonus spins....that's what those gamblers really seem to eat up. This just re-inforces the casinos case that VP machines eat up valuable space on the gaming floor that pennie machines could be using.

[notes1]

Only problem I see with the "make them pay approach"...they seem more than happy to say ok VP is dead (we know its because of paytables etc) we will remove them machines and slide in MORE 1c machines that cost $1 plus a spin and pay out 30 dollars on super doper bonus spins....that's what those gamblers really seem to eat up. This just re-inforces the casinos case that VP machines eat up valuable space on the gaming floor that pennie machines could be using.
  poker, you are correct, they would love nothing better than to have all 80-85% pay out slots.but, that is assuming that slot players are not getting fed up also. i know a couple of slot players and they are also seeing reduced payouts. many are telling me that they are adjusting their play, just like we are. other the prime time, many slot machines are also idle.  VP was never the big money maker for casinos, for decades they have made their money from slots. your description of me asking everyone to 'make them pay' is spot on. i guess i am hoping all players, no matter the game, do the same. most of us do not want to give up playing, not me. just give them less and hope they get the hint.

[pokerforme]

I stopped playing slots 5 years ago or so when the wave of 1c machines really took off. After my last VP trip I pretty much have no want anymore. First time I ever got completely blanked....they can find a new customer. We still get all the offers and they are offering a great free vacation...they can keep it. Besides I just don't have the time anyways. I NEVER had the results or even close of my last trip. Things have changed...I always was close to even or better and staying/eating/playing some on there money but see no reason to continue if they are going to take the play all the way out of there machines.

[notes1]

pokerforme, way to let it all the anger out. feel like you opened 'a can of whup as#', with that post. if the casinos do not treat you right, make em pay.