Random? I don't think so.

[Carcounter]

Ray, You are not going crazy. I too like Phil do not think the games are "rigged", but sometimes things seem to just go very badly. My last 2 trips to Borgata, I played a total of about 5 hours at maybe 600 hands per hr on 9/5 Super Double Bonus a game with a 99.69% theo. So roughly 3,000 hands. One damn quad, dealt 4's. Lost a total of $1,100. Funny thing was I was being dealt a ton of trips and never connected on one. I kept thinking when this turns around, I'll start connecting on my fair share. Never happened, so I can see where someone who had that experience would say WTF.

[BobDancer]

Here are the choices.  You can accept losses as part of the game.    You can reduce those losses by playing less, playing smaller, or playing slower.   You can avoid all of these by doing something else with your free time.  The choice is up to you.






One point omitted by FP is that you can limit your play to games where the odds exceed 100% --- including slot club, mailers, and cashable comps --- factored by your accuracy.

If you cannot find those games, refusing to play is the only way not to lose long term. If you insist on playing anyway, FP outlined your negative options clearly enough.

Insofar as the original poster's comment, for the past 25 years at least I've known losing players who believe the games are not as good as they used to be because they used to win and now they can't.

Then, as now, this argument is the province of players going through losing streaks. These streaks absolutely happen and many players draw conclusions about the streak continuing.

You can ALWAYS find agreement among losing players that the games are rigged. Those of us who have figured out the game and limit ourselves to good opportunities know this isn't true.

[FloridaPhil]

[quote=BobDancer]You can ALWAYS find agreement among losing players that the games are rigged.[/quote]How true.   Best quote of the day.   

[FAA]

Phil, I chose the play less option. FP plus $100 coin in wets my beak. Then I sample the city's offerings. Like the TV show, I've been breaking bad. They were meth addicts and I am en route to being a VP addict. So it's keep the casino happy enough to continue my FP and exit forthwith. It'll be fun to venture out and renew acquaintances with the sub shop, bakery, etc.

[FAA]

Car, if Ray is going crazy, the three of us should be held in adjacent rubber rooms. If nothing else, it'll save us from our funds. We can play on our electronic devices of choice. Too many bad AC runs. I'm curtailing the donations. The liquor will flow regardless.

[FloridaPhil]

Here's a plan.  What if we only went to the casino once a year?  We fly to Vegas and play one of those positive games we keep hearing about.  We both bet our IRAs.  If  we go broke you can help me out by getting me a job as a greeter at Walmart and I will build you a website.    We'll pass the time by stopping by South Point to visit our former bankrolls.     

[Carcounter]

In spite of my recent bad run, I am still up 1k for the year thanks to 6k worth of royals, so this is part of what I accept when I play. I go down to AC, about a 1 hour and 10 minute drive from my office. I find myself going down when things get slow at the office and I get bored. Been this way for a while. However I only play the highest available games, 99.54 JOB or 99.69% SDB. With cashback and comp dollars I am very close to a 100% theo. I have done well over the years and keep good records. I don't gamble with anything but some small amount of excess cash that I have access to. Usually about 5,000-10,000 dollars at anytime. Now when dollar All Americans were in AC prior to the recession, I went down more often and kept a bigger bankroll as they were well over 100% especially with the good slot clubs at the time. You have to adjust to current market conditions. Good luck to all, but don't play bad games.I know it's hard when they are all that is available, but discipline in a VP players best friend.

[FloridaPhil]

[quote=carcounter]However I only play the highest available games, 99.54 JOB or 99.69%
SDB. With cashback and comp dollars I am very close to a 100% theo.[/quote]Your story is similar to mine.   The major difference is I only have 98-99% games available to me and cash back is a fantasy.   To counter this, I play small to hold my cost to play VP as low as possible.   This year, thanks to five royals I am significantly ahead.  Over all the years I have played VP, I am behind.  My personal issue is not financial, it's mental.  I don't enjoy losing money.  I realize it's part of the game, but that doesn't help my attitude on a bad day.What I can't figure out is this.  "100% theo" is a far cry from "living a nice lifestyle" off VP.   I have a hard time comprehending how this is even possible without counting revenue from other sources.  Why is this important to me?  It's not, but it does cause me to question some of the claims that are being made.

[Carcounter]

Phil, I have no desire to move to Nevada and try to become an AP. From what Bob Dancer writes, it is not a healthy or desirable lifestyle for me, but I respect what he and other AP's do. I think they do earn a living, some more than others. However, where I differ from you is that I will not play 98% games, I will find something else to do. (Maybe a little sports betting?) I cannot bring myself to play poor paytables. When they are all that is available, I am gone. I once drove 4 hours up to Foxwoods when it first opened, spent a couple of hours searching paytables and didn't play a thing. Had dinner and drove 4 hours home

[FloridaPhil]

[quote=Carcounter]However, where I differ from you is that I will not play 98% games, I will find something else to do.[/quote]Unless I want to move up to $5 games, 98% is about as good as it gets around here.  For me, playing $5 VP would be a disaster.  I'm not nearly accurate enough and I would have a nervous breakdown enduring losses like that.    Recently I have significantly reduced my time at the casinos.   Since my wife fell three weeks ago, I haven't been back.   When she recovers we may return, but it won't be on a weekly basis.   Quarter games are made for a player like me.  If I play 25 cents a hand, I can play all day for the price of a tank of gas.  If I want to experience a max coin royal flush, it costs me four to five times that much.  Some days I'm in the mood, sometimes not.As far as Vegas APs go, I wish them well.  The math doesn't add up to me, but perhaps I don't know all that's involved.   I'll stick to playing cheap.   I don't mind paying to play VP as long as I can enjoy the casino experience on my terms.