CS Revisited

[FloridaPhil]

[quote=billryan]Voodoo and superstitions.[/quote]Thanks BOB.  I thought you were on vacation? 

[olds442jetaway]

Voodo your thing and others here can do their own thing whatever that is as long as it is either fun or works for them....By the way...ever thought about going back to wherever you came from?

[FloridaPhil]

[quote=billryan]Just what an aspiring video poker player comes here for. [/quote]If you think math is the end all answer to every video poker question, you're playing the wrong game son.  That RNG does strange things sometimes.  It doesn't owe you a jackpot either.  Lots of folks went broke waiting for it.

[FloridaPhil]

Here's the way I see it.  If you believe like I do that the RNG is fair and spits out completely random numbers, there can never be any perfect strategy that can guarantee you will be a winner.  Some players will win and some will
lose.  Those that win using math based strategies will believe it is the only way to win.  A few may write books, sell their strategy to players or even base an entire career on their winning testimonials.   Are they wrong?  Heck no, their strategy works for them!Others
will win only when they wear a lucky shirt, when playing single coin or when playing at a certain casino.  
Those same players will swear on a stack of Bibles that their strategy
is the only way to win.  Wasting your time trying to convince someone that they can't possibly win when they are happy playing their way is a dead end.  If it didn't work for them, they would have abandoned their strategy long before you came on the scene.The truth is there is no way to influence what the RNG
does and no way to predict it won't do something totally unpredictable
like ring up a big jackpot after a 4 coin win.Math is only good for predicting what the odds are for a certain thing to happen, it's useless for predicting that it actually will happen to you.  It's your money, play the way you want and don't get hung up because your way doesn't match someone else's standard.  Video poker is suppose to be fun.  We're not contemplating the universe here...

[billryan]

[quote=billryan]Just what an aspiring video poker player comes here for. If you think math is the end all answer to every video poker question, you're playing the wrong game son.  That RNG does strange things sometimes.  It doesn't owe you a jackpot either.  Lots of folks went broke waiting for it.
[/QUOTE]


I look at it like this- In my lifetime, I might hit three, four ,maybe five Royal Flush's. When I do, I want it paying $1,000, not $62.50. Since I don't know if the next one is next hand, or 45,000 hands from now, I need to be prepared.

[FloridaPhil]

[quote=billryan]I look at it like this- In my lifetime, I might hit three, four ,maybe
five Royal Flush's. When I do, I want it paying $1,000, not $62.50.
Since I don't know if the next one is next hand, or 45,000 hands from
now, I need to be prepared.[/quote]I totally understand your point of view.   When you first start out playing video poker, it seems the entire game revolves around the royal flush. The excitement of hitting one is the peak point of the game and absolutely no one wants to be short changed on that experience.  If you play long enough you will eventually learn that the royal flush is rare, but it's just another hand.   Obviously It's a very special hand because it makes up a large part of the return.If you play games which pay less than 100%, the math says you will lose.  This may or may not be true, but the mathematical odds are overwhelmingly against you. This means most players will lose more if they bet more.  The casino knows this very well and that is why they give you free stuff or cash back trying to coerce you to try your luck again.  Everyone thinks they can beat the math.  The fact is few ever do and the casino pays their bills.Playing slower or playing less is the only proven way to limit your losses on these negative games.  Playing single coin is "playing less".  It sacrifices the thrill of a max coin royal flush for the long term benefit of saving you money as you play.None of this means anything to Bob Dancer because he does not address playing negative games at all.  He says he would never play a negative game, which is excellent advice if profit is your motivation.  Recreational players want to win too, but they are more interested in fun and relaxation than doing what it takes to chance being a long term winner.   In addition, most can't fly to Vegas every time they want to play or risk making big bets on the possibility they may capitalize on an edge.  I am a strong proponent of recreational video poker play, but never suggested everyone should play the way I do and I certainly do not think anyone is stupid or misinformed if they don't.    If your goal is to make a profit playing video poker, know that Mr. Dancer is the world's expert on professional video poker play and follow his teachings to the letter.  There is no one size fits all strategy for video poker play because everyone's motivations and circumstances are different.  There should be room for everyone on this forum and all sides should be able to discuss their views openly and without intimidation.  

[FAA]

it seems the entire game revolves around the royal flush.---------------------------------------------------------------------------On JOB, that is the mother lode. If you fall behind $50, not even a quad makes you whole. The improbable straight flush will barely cover your losses if you are on max coin. I'd like to try a DW session for the hell of it. I have practiced enough to get the hang of it. I am a little battle scarred and nervous. The $100 JOB losing session last visit took a lot of wind out of my sails.

[FAA]

I look at it like this- In my lifetime, I might hit three, four
,maybe five Royal Flushes. When I do, I want it paying $1,000, not
$62.50.------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------It must really be rough to produce that outlook. If I looked at it that way, I would simply quit. My expectation, perhaps fueled by brisker than average AC machine turnover, is one RF per year. I figure I just had my one for the year at $1,000. Last year I had two. The first was for $1,000. The second was while killing time on my way out the door and yielded the bitter $62.50. I still do min coin 5% of the time. But with quads every five to nine hundred hands lately, hell, it really should be CS 90% of the time. Phil has the right idea.

[FloridaPhil]

When playing CS you can play 4-5 times as many hands as someone playing max coins with the same bankroll.  This means you will see 4-5 times as many quad deuces and royal flushes.  A few of these jackpots will hit at max coins giving you the financial benefit of max coins without the cost.   When I played CS all the time, I was averaging about one royal every other month.  Most hit at $62.50, a few hit at $1,000 or more.  It didn't matter to me how much they paid as long as I stayed ahead of my bankroll and I did. This doesn't work for most players because they can't stomach the idea of hitting a short coin royal and they are conditioned to believe professional strategy is the only way to play video poker.   The math doesn't lie.  If you play negative games at max coins you will lose more over time than if you play single coin at the same denomination.If you can play video poker with an edge on the casino and you have the skill to stay even with the computer, you would be a fool to play anything other than max coins.

[billryan]

When playing CS you can play 4-5 times as many hands as someone playing max coins with the same bankroll. This means you will see 4-5 times as many quad deuces and royal flushes.


That's where your whole foundation falls apart, unless you are talking about somebody with a $50 bankroll.

You and I walk into the same casino, with the same $10,000 payroll. We sit side by side and ply at the same speed. how are you getting four or five times more hands than me? That only works if I exhaust my payroll and you keep playing. In the end, my bankroll will crush yours because while I'm getting max pay for the Royal, you are getting anywhere from $62.50 to $1000 but the vast majority will be at less than full value.

So, yes. If you are severely underfunded and playing bad games, your strategy will allow you to lose your money slower. An even better strategy would be to begin making the days between gambling longer. Instead of twice a week, go once a week. Now you made your bankroll last twice as long. Put aside that money and soon you'll have a proper bankroll and not need to try to reinvent the wheel.