I call it 1-2-3 DDB

[Zid]

I guess then, that I need further education. Where is it written that a casino can't adjust a machine, at will, to its satisfaction -- assuming there to be a range of payout settings? Especially at the more unregulated tribal casinos, where I play?

-0-

On an earlier topic -- my 1-2-3 "method." In full confession mode:

Visited the casino today. Was there for six hours. Started with precisely 575 fp dollars that I had "won" at a player event last week.

The game: DDB, 9-6 dollar machine. The bet: $2 to start, then $1 if I lose or $3 if I win.

I gambled the entire $575 fp over about 45 mins. At that point, I had winnings of just over $600. Not bad, I thought.

But then my old nemesis kicks in. I thought to myself, "surely we can go for $1000." I did...and got there! Just over $1000. Kicking up the bet sequence after the first $600 to 1-3-5.

And did I then quit with this "free" $1000+? (I certainly should have.)

Nope. My auto-pilot had kicked in and I guess I was going for $2000. I left 4 hrs later in that sorry state of capitulation.   Yes, giving it all back (and foregoing my beloved bro-in-laws commandment #1: DISCIPLINE!!!).

I'm sure, if you are reading this, that you've been to that same corner. I will be there agaIn on Sunday, trying to TURN $200 into $500 AND THEN HEADING FOR THE GARAGE.

[billryan]

Education and discipline. Two of the three legs of the gamblers triad. Third being bankroll.
You might want to forget what you think you know and start working on all three.   

[billryan]

I'm loath to say this because it comes off as superstitious, and it really is.
So many times when I'm on a machine and winning , I would establish a goal. I'll be up $65 and say I'm going to quit at $80. I'll get to $78, $79 and hit a small losing streak. Down to $65, then back up to $78, but it seems I can never win that last bet to get me over the hump.
Countless times, I'd be one winning bet away from my win goal and end the night far from it.
Now I don't set any goal. I arrive with X, ready to play it and play until I've had enough or lost X.
No more walking out up $65, annoyed that I didn't hit $80.
If I hit early, and feel like keeping on playing, I do with no regrets.

[billryan]

Jacks or Better
Pay Table
Pay-back
6/5 95.00%
7/5 96.15%
8/5 97.30%
8/6 98.39%
9/5 98.45%
9/6 99.54%

In a regulated casino, if the pay table says 9/6, the machine will pay out 99.54%. There is no switch the casino can throw to suddenly make it pay 97%.
Only thing that will drop the pay out on most machines is if the player is mathematically challenged and thinks playing single coins will work better than max coins.
Some machines do pay the same for one, three or five coins, but they are pretty rare. In almost all cases, playing max coins brings max pay outs.The casino can change the payout from 9/6 to 8/5 or 7/5, but its not as easy as throwing a switch and cant be done while the machine is in play.

[Zid]

Good info and I thank you.

So you are saying here that VP machines are not "adjustable" by the house? I realize there is no "master switch" in the sky for changes on the fly, but I find it hard to believe that a casino -- tribe casinos especially -- can't adjust machines in a 2 a.m. maintenance visit should they sense that payouts are too high -- or clientele too low.

Case in point, perhaps: Last year, I hit about 8 jackpots between January and July. Total winnings = ~ $25,000. And the vp machines at my casino were hopping with players.

Then from August onward -- not even a winning run, let alone a jack pot run. I was getting hammered every single time. I spoke to a casino host about it and he told me "You're not the only one, and yes they have made "adjustments" because players were winning too much."

That's an accurate quote, too. I couldn't believe his candor, but he said it and I assumed he knew what he was talking about.

For all the losing, I visited only occasionally (a couple of times per month) when January arrived. I also wrote them a letter explaining why I was pulling back.
(The host said that they do read letters.) By April, I was a shadow of the VP gambler I had been, betting wise -- AND, the vp section was devoid of players.

Then I started winning again -- with this 1-2-3 method that may or may not be realistic. I'll have a better sense of all this by, say, Labor Day. But Potowatomi in Milwaukee is one of the best casinos in my collection. The win record there is, by far, better than Vegas. And the food and hotel comps are most generous. Haven't paid to dine there in years, and I risk less than a thou per month of my own money.

FWIW

P.S. I am retired and don't work at or for Potowatomi. Talked to them about a job but was told you can't gamble there if you work there. A deal breaker if there ever was one.

[Zid]

Also -- the "pay table", to my sense, is often confused with the RATE of payouts. The pay table is what it is -- 9/6, 8/5. Right there in print for all to see and obviously not adjustable. The rate of payouts would seem another and unrelated story...and a factor, it would seem of settings in the machine itself.

[FloridaPhil]

[quote=billryan]Only thing that will drop the pay out on most machines is if the player
is mathematically challenged and thinks playing single coins will work
better than max coins.[/quote]I have decided to become a kinder gentler FP.  No more arguing or petty crap from me just plain old comments.Most people who who play single coin are not mathematically challenged as you say.  He/she knows he is giving up return.  They do this to save money by putting less money through a negative video poker machine.  Telling a grand dad or mom on a pension not to play single coin quarters is unkind.   No one on this forum ever said playing single coin pays better.  Please correct your statement.  Not everyone in the world can play perfectly either.  Some have physical problems like failing eyesight or handicaps.  For these people playing single coin also saves them money by limiting their loses.  Please try to understand that not everyone plays with the same skill and opportunities as you do.  Thank you. 

[FAA]

Absolutely. I am not mathematically challenged, but philosophically reconciled. I give up big time return if the mother lode comes in. Meanwhile, I save 40-80% per hand. Life is full of trade offs.   

[billryan]

Also -- the "pay table", to my sense, is often confused with the RATE of payouts. The pay table is what it is -- 9/6, 8/5. Right there in print for all to see and obviously not adjustable. The rate of payouts would seem another and unrelated story...and a factor, it would seem of settings in the machine itself.

No, in video poker they are one and the same.
The pay table is all important in this game and it is vital you learn to recognize a good table from a bad one. Often you will find them side by side. In one of my favorite casinos, there is a bank of machines. Eight have NSUD at 15-9, two have it at 16-10. A quarter player choosing the wrong machine gives up several dollars an hour playing the 15-9 machine.

[Zid]

billryan --

Honest question: how can one verify that a vp machine -- owned, after all, by the casino -- can't be adjusted to reflect greater or fewer payouts on any given day? In a hands-on way -- not by some ray gun approach from the eye in the sky mechanism.

The payout table on, say, a 9/6 jacks or better tells me that a full house will pay $9 and a flush will pay $6.
But why should we assume that that must happen at a pace that only the machine can control -- and not the owner of the machine? Seems counterintuitive to me that one casino --- for a dropoff in business -- couldn't "set" their machines to hit more fh hands and higher to bring back clientele. I will always have difficulty understanding the theory that a vp machine can't be adjusted to pay as often as its owner wants it to pay, for the success of that casino's business.

Any book on this specific subject you can recommend. I thought I had read them all.

Or maybe there is a simple answer and I have missed it over 25 years at the game.