Money Management

[Burtwithau]

I have read a number of informative threads and posts concerning this and it made me wonder what the "state of the art" money management techniques there are for the myriad of scenarios that can occur.  For example, for day/evening trips to a local casino I usually bring 200-300 dollars and sometimes either lose some or all of same (losing session).  I have to admit that my stopping point for these sessions is dictated by the fact that I was no longer enjoying the experience and moved off to other pursuits (the only thing that I have read that this is close to is Shackleford's take on MM).On winning sessions I usually place a stop-loss and move it up (if I'm continuing to win) or cash-out when it get's hit.  I know that these self imposed breaks does nothing to the EV but finishing ahead is better than taking a winning session into a loss. IMHO Additionally, I believe that sometimes it's not how much you win but how much you don't lose. For trips to Vegas I employ slight variations to these techniques.  I welcome other's hints and suggestions.  Lastly, I hope everyone stays safe tomorrow, on 12/31.

[BillyJoe]

I am sure that Mr Dancer will chime in on this thread at some point, but I, for one, applaud any kind of money management technique for gaming that maximizes your enjoyment of the experience.
 
I set Stop Win/Loss points for all my VP gaming sessions. I agree that it does not change the EV, but for me, it enhances my overall enjoyment of a gaming trip.  

[Rayser]

Interesting topic,  I do exactly as you do, Burtwithau.  I feel a greater sense of satisfaction if I can walk away with a profit, no matter what it is, so when If I get lets say $50.00 or more ahead, I set a stop loss above my original stake, and walk away from that machine with a profit.   If I have time left on my trip, I will go to another machine after a break, or I may come back to the same machine later.  I know there is no statistical edge that I am giving myself, but it's just the way I play.  I am very interested on opinions or tactics of others.

[FloridaPhil]

Ah yes, my favorite subject. Mr. Dancer will say that stop loss systems don't work. That may be true in his world, but not in mine.  Keep in mind that a money management system will only work if you have the discipline to stick to it.  (Not easy).  My system goes like this.  I play 1000 coins per session, in my case that's $250.   I play mostly DW or DDB.  I break my money into $20 bills and put no more than $20 in the machine at a time.  I always cash out immediately if I get a quad or a straight flush in DDB or quad deuces in DW. I put the white cash out tickets in my wallet and zip them up so I can't get to them easily.  Once I have $250 in white tickets, I can move up in denomination or leave the casino.  I never (that means never) cash my white tickets until I'm heading out the door. I almost always leave the casino with at least some money.  Once in a while, I don't get a quad in DDW or quad deuces in 1000 coins of play, but that is very rare.  If this happen to you frequently, you probably need to brush up on your play strategy.  I use Dancers Video Poker for Winners to train and I highly recommend it.  Some days I only take home $62.50.  Many times I break even.   Occasionally when I have $250 in my wallet, I switch to .50 or dollar play and score a good one.  If you use this system you will not become Bob Dancer, but you will be able to manage your money more effectively and stop chasing your losses.  The problem most recreational video poker players have is they keep playing until their busted.  Then, they take out their debit cards and lose more money. If that's your strategy, you are guaranteed to lose.  One more time... NEVER EVER CASH YOUR WHITE TICKETS UNTIL YOU ARE READY TO LEAVE.  GET OUT OF THE CASINO, GET IN YOUR CAR AND LEAVE.   
 
 
 

[Kralj]

Money Management is the key for success in long-term poker. You can be the best player in this world, but if you don't know how to use your bankroll then you won't have much money in online poker

[FloridaPhil]

I totally agree.   You can learn to make the right plays with a computer.  You can learn to play the right games with your eyes.  But, learning to manage your money is a whole different skill set.  I've been playing video poker for about 10 years and I am just now starting to get a handle on this.   At this point, I don't believe it's possible to overcome negative odds with any money management system long term.  I do believe that a disciplined player with a well thought out system can shave those odds in his favor considerably.
 

[shadowman]

The big advantage of money management (wind goals/loss limits) is the reduction in the amount of play. The is very important when playing negative return games. A person leaves the casino much sooner than they would do otherwise which reduces the amount of money they risk. The more one plays negative return games the more they can expect to lose.
 
The reason Dancer and other players, who have positive games available to them, don't worry about these factors is they only play those positive opportunities. In those cases the more you play the more money you make.

[Tedlark]

  Webman, please review the post a couple spots above mine that was posted by Kralj.

[FloridaPhil]

[quote]  The big advantage of money management (wind goals/loss limits) is the reduction in the amount of play. The is very important when playing negative return games. A person leaves the casino much sooner than they would do otherwise which reduces the amount of money they risk. The more one plays negative return games the more they can expect to lose.   [/quote]
 
   How true, think about all those days you kept feeding the machine, hoping things would turn around and they didn't. 

[BobDancer]

[quote]  The big advantage of money management (wind goals/loss limits) is the reduction in the amount of play. The is very important when playing negative return games. A person leaves the casino much sooner than they would do otherwise which reduces the amount of money they risk. The more one plays negative return games the more they can expect to lose.  
 
   How true, think about all those days you kept feeding the machine, hoping things would turn around and they didn't.  [/QUOTE]Your response is a non sequitur. Having losing sessions continue is just one of the possibilities.Even those of us who only play positive games have had days where we keep losing, losing, losing and it never turned around. We have also had days where we were losing big --- and then hit a couple of jackpots and ended up winners. Stop loss limits will stop both of these. They will keep you from losing really big today, and they will keep you from hitting late jackpots and making a comeback. Overall, stop loss limits do nothing. Stop loss limits are based on the assumption that today's score is something special. It isn't. Today's score is just one data point on this year's score --- which is just one data point on your lifetime score. It really doesn't matter if you lost $1000 on January 2 and won $2000 on February 9 --- or won $2000 on January 2 and lost $1000 on February 9. They both add up to a $1000 win. Which day was plus and which day was minus is totally irrelevant.SM's post a few days ago was spot on. I take it a bit further than he did, however. I believe your stop loss limit while playing a negative game should be less than one penny! And if you ever exceed that loss limit playing a negative game, stop playing immediately! And assuming you are playing within your bankroll, there is no need for a stop loss when you're playing a positive game.There are positive games available in most jurisdictions. You just have to find them. Settling for negative games is very expensive.