What is the liklihood of Casino cheating at VP?

[ko king]

[QUOTE=ko king]I came to understand when it came to actually knowing about the game I was the only one in the room with a clue.

You never admitted which casino this happened at but at the one I am thinking could be, they are required to offer Class III video poker with their gaming compact. If it isn't a random standard poker deck, it would be in violation of the compact with the state.

Page 115 of lengthy pdf, bottom of relevant page says page 52 though.

http://www.bia.gov/cs/groups/xoig/docum ... 038317.pdf

Of course, the casino could be cheating on the compact anyway. Randomness is a hard thing for a human to sense.

And casino employees can be some of the worst people to ask about how these are supposed to work obviously. I had an hour-long fight with a casino manager over a programming mistake on a 25-play Super Times Pay machine at Monte Carlo back in May. It improperly made me max bet. He and the idiot slot tech disagreed. He eventually gave me $5 (my approximate loss to shut me up).

And ironically, last night while at the Tunica Roadhouse, I had similar issue with a "Hexbreaker" slot machine as its screen was miscalibrated, so I end up betting $1.95/spin versus $0.13/spin. The slot manager was already in the area greeting another player, so I waved him over. But I explained the problem, they verified it, and gave me $10 for the inconvenience and to cover the ~$4 lost by my initial spin, and their test spin on my money.

Soon after I hit a bonus, and he said, "I bet you were wishing you were max betting now!"


Unfortunately Tunica is mostly meh for paytables now with the Roadhouse downgrades this past April. But since you like DDB, all Caesars' properties in Tunica do now offer 9/6 DDB for dollars (or $5) along with Bally's and Fitz. And the CET games and the Bally's game is at the bar if you like to indulge like I do... That's better than what Cape offers, assuming all these places follow their states' laws of course. But I agree, Cape is a nice place. Just a little small for my taste. :( But they do have 2c Double STP that Roadhouse got rid of. :( [/QUOTE]
Roadhouse used to be my favorite place to play but I just don't like the new machines. For one reason I haven't done any good playing them but for some reason and it may just be me I have to be very carefull when I want to hold the card in the first spot, for whatever reason when I oush the button it fails to hold the card, at first I thought it was just that machine but it was happening on every one I played. I think the hold buttons may be sread a little different or something.I haven't been to Bally's in years and the truth is I didn't think they were still there. The Fitz is okay, I play there every once in a while.

[Vman96]

Roadhouse used to be my favorite place to play but I just don't like the new machines. For one reason I haven't done any good playing them but for some reason and it may just be me I have to be very carefull when I want to hold the card in the first spot, for whatever reason when I oush the button it fails to hold the card, at first I thought it was just that machine but it was happening on every one I played. I think the hold buttons may be sread a little different or something.I haven't been to Bally's in years and the truth is I didn't think they were still there. The Fitz is okay, I play there every once in a while.

Hmm, I haven't noticed a button pushing issue with these yet, but I play a ridiculously slow pace too, so maybe I press them hard enough or space the timing of button presses far enough apart or whatever.

Generally though, I really don't like the new IGT design at all. Buttons are bigger and feel clunky to me, and the small game audio tweaks they have made on STP/Double STP I'm not a fan of either. If Roadhouse got rid of 98%+ Double STP for nickels, I'd probably just stay at the hotel during the week and play elsewhere since I am off CET's radar anyway. Results on the two trips since the replacements...um, not bad, nor good.

[olds442jetaway]

I'll take the old game king machines any day. I have had button issues too on some of the new ones. I can understand if you push the button, it doesn't say held, and you hit deal. That is just playing too fast. In my case lately, it says held, then the held disappears just as you are pressing down on deal and it is too late to stop it. Just lost a full house the other day that way. Mohegan Sun has one bank of old vp machines left that I always play. They won't even take the new hundreds. Slot tech says when they crap out, they are gone for good.
     My slow pace kicks in only at the bar. A beer in one hand and holding the cards and hitting deal with the other. Of course if I'm driving home that night, it has to be O'douls or Buckler. Like both equally well.

[spxChrome]

Well cheat is not the right word but the new machines don't pay the same and since they changed the chips out back in Nov. 2010 the old machines don't either. I was there when they changed them out and asked the slot tech why and he just said "because I was told to do it... we got new chips and they needed to be replaced asap". Didn't make any sense because after the change the paytable and games stayed the same. Bank of 8 $1 9/6 Progressive. I'm still convinced the RNG is preflop only nowadays. And after the draw its based on a payback% set inside the chip. I keep very good records of quads+ hands and I have not calculated for 2013 yet but I know of the top of my head premium hands were few and far between as opposed to garbage quads.

[PamE]

Well cheat is not the right word but the new machines don't pay the same and since they changed the chips out back in Nov. 2010 the old machines don't either. I was there when they changed them out and asked the slot tech why and he just said "because I was told to do it... we got new chips and they needed to be replaced asap". Didn't make any sense because after the change the paytable and games stayed the same. Bank of 8 $1 9/6 Progressive. I'm still convinced the RNG is preflop only nowadays. And after the draw its based on a payback% set inside the chip. I keep very good records of quads+ hands and I have not calculated for 2013 yet but I know of the top of my head premium hands were few and far between as opposed to garbage quads.

This is the best explanation I've read to explain the current state of the new VP machines.

[ko king]

[QUOTE=ko king]

Roadhouse used to be my favorite place to play but I just don't like the new machines. For one reason I haven't done any good playing them but for some reason and it may just be me I have to be very carefull when I want to hold the card in the first spot, for whatever reason when I oush the button it fails to hold the card, at first I thought it was just that machine but it was happening on every one I played. I think the hold buttons may be sread a little different or something.I haven't been to Bally's in years and the truth is I didn't think they were still there. The Fitz is okay, I play there every once in a while.

Hmm, I haven't noticed a button pushing issue with these yet, but I play a ridiculously slow pace too, so maybe I press them hard enough or space the timing of button presses far enough apart or whatever.

Generally though, I really don't like the new IGT design at all. Buttons are bigger and feel clunky to me, and the small game audio tweaks they have made on STP/Double STP I'm not a fan of either. If Roadhouse got rid of 98%+ Double STP for nickels, I'd probably just stay at the hotel during the week and play elsewhere since I am off CET's radar anyway. Results on the two trips since the replacements...um, not bad, nor good. [/QUOTE]
The buttons are bigger and since I play with both hands it could be I'm not popping the button hard enough with my left hand, never had this problem before. I don't guess I'm off the radar, I get a stack of free meals and hotel rooms every week. I've got some neat stuff this week from the casinos, I can go on a couple of cruises for two and I've got free airfare and hotel rooms for a week in Colorado, not sure if I'll take them up on any of it but I do know I will accept their offer for us to play golf at Cottonwoods. I've been told by more than one person I play faster than anyone they've ever seen, the last couple of years that's not a good thing though.

[ko king]

Well cheat is not the right word but the new machines don't pay the same and since they changed the chips out back in Nov. 2010 the old machines don't either. I was there when they changed them out and asked the slot tech why and he just said "because I was told to do it... we got new chips and they needed to be replaced asap". Didn't make any sense because after the change the paytable and games stayed the same. Bank of 8 $1 9/6 Progressive. I'm still convinced the RNG is preflop only nowadays. And after the draw its based on a payback% set inside the chip. I keep very good records of quads+ hands and I have not calculated for 2013 yet but I know of the top of my head premium hands were few and far between as opposed to garbage quads.
I never seen any chip changing and none of the paytables changed but 2010 is about the time I started noticing it was costing me more to play. I keep very good records myself and I was playing $2 denomination DDB at max play just like I have for about 20 years running so I was not only losing more money I was getting fewer W2's.

[olds442jetaway]

W-2Gs dropping like flies every year since 2010 yet play and $ in for the year has increased every year. That of course is what they want. Finally saw the light late in 2013. Go just as often, but play much more conservative and lower denominations. Comps of course have dropped way off, but as we know they are not really free anyway. One slot tech who was in charge of the major revamp/installations in 2010 and 2011, insists to me that paytables mean nothing and vp is no different than any other slot. It was very late at night and he was tired when he said this and he seemed to regret it afterwards. I have no way of knowing if this was BS or not. I haven't seen him since either and he had been around for years!!!

[spxChrome]

I once saw the ex Casino Manager playing VP at another casino in town. We got to talking about her time at the other casino and I expressed how it seems things have changed over the past couple of years and she just nodded her head and did not elaborate. I asked since she no longer worked there if she could play there now. She said she could but she would not... I asked why and she just said she wouldn't. I pushed and asked about why she thought the VP did not play the same and why they changed out the chips on all the VP machines. Again she just looked at me leaned in and said (in a voice like she should not even be talking about it)if I were you I wouldn't play there anymore. So I left it at that to bad I didn't take her advice. So when a former casino manager tells you not to play there anymore you should listen.

[edog743]

Chrome, You get a pearl of wisdom from a casino manager and you fail to heed her advice?  I have said it before and I will say it again You people that think the casino's are cheating or something is different. Then you go back to the same casino to get raped and pillaged of your money again are DUMB,DUMB AS HELL.
I'm just saying...