ddb puzzle

[ansoda]

I have been playing 10 play ddb on vpw at  an almost perfect level except for one strategy that I can't seem to grasp.
When holding an ace against two face cards on the draw, the recommended hold seems arbitrary. As follows from a 300 hand session I just finished.
   Ad-Kh- Qs-8h-3c = hold A
   Ac-Qd-Jc-4h-2d=    hold QJ  
   As-Kh-Jc- 4h 2c=     hold A
   Ah- Jd- 7h-2h-Qs=  hold JQ
   Ac-Ks-Qh-7c-6h=     hold A
   Etc. for  3 more draws.
What am I missing? I have more or less quit trying to figure it out and just play the A  if the face cards are not suited.
Thanks for any help. 

[bigboy]

What paytable are using when you make your analysis?
I ask because if it's 9/6, vpw shows a different result for the 2nd hand.

[bigboy]

Ac, Jc are held on the 2nd hand, not QJ per vpw 9/6DDB.

[shadowman]

When holding QJ unsuited you have more straight possibilities than when holding KQ, KJ, AK, AQ or AJ. And, when two suited face cards are dealt you also have flush, straight flush and RF possibilities. You should hold two suited faces first, unsuited QJs next and finally just an Ace.
 
If you think this is bad you should try DB. It is much more complicated.

[ansoda]

Thanks for your help. The reason I'm playing ddb more is because of the complications in db. but I will tackle that next . You will probably see a post or two from me in the near future. Good luck to all!

[MikeA]

In that second hand with the Ac-Jc-Qd-4h-2d, the correct DDB full pay (10/6) best play is to hold the suited A-J.  That is true according to VPW whether you are playing against perfect play (ie, with penalty cards) or against "strategy" (simplified).  Maybe it is possible that you keyed in the hand incorrectly?Now, had the Jack and Queen been of different suits than the Ace whether they matched each other or not, you would hold the Jack-Queen instead of the solitary Ace.  that would make it the same as hand 4: (Ah-Jd-Qs-7h-2h) Of course, if the J-Q were of the same suit, you would hold them instead of the Ace also.I have been playing 10 play ddb on vpw at  an almost perfect level except for one strategy that I can't seem to grasp.
When holding an ace against two face cards on the draw, the recommended hold seems arbitrary. As follows from a 300 hand session I just finished.
   Ad-Kh- Qs-8h-3c = hold A
   Ac-Qd-Jc-4h-2d=    hold QJ  
   As-Kh-Jc- 4h 2c=     hold A
   Ah- Jd- 7h-2h-Qs=  hold JQ
   Ac-Ks-Qh-7c-6h=     hold A
   Etc. for  3 more draws.
What am I missing? I have more or less quit trying to figure it out and just play the A  if the face cards are not suited.
Thanks for any help. 

[bbgun419]

what's the bankroll requirement for $1.00 five play (DDB) anybody? I've been playing 9/6 ddb and doing quite bad....lost 7 sessions out of 8. Any advice pls. thanks!

[shadowman]

The overall bankroll for 9/6 DDB is infinite. It's a negative game and all negative games have infinite bankroll requirements. OTOH, if you mean for a single session (that is, weekend trip or the like) then we need to know how long you will play and your rate of play (how many hands/hour).
 
That said, I can give an estimate ... assuming 600 hands/hour of $1 5-play 9/6 DDB ... your coin-in will be 600*5*5 = $15,000/hour ... 9/6 DDB pays back 99% over time with perfect play ... with perfect play you should expect to lose $150/hour over time.
 
Since DDB is a very volatile game you should probably win about 40% of the time you play a couple hour session of 5-play. If your session length is close to this and you play very accurately then you have been somewhat unlucky in losing 7 out of 8 sessions. This past week I never won a session (6) playing a game of similar volatility so it really isn't that unusual.
 

[royal flush]

great answer

[bbgun419]

wow!!! thanks Shadowman, with your knowledge, pls tell you are beating the game? btw, do you think the machines in Indian Reservation casinos fixed? is there any gaming control over them?