"IF YOU BELIEVE IT'S RIGGED, WHY PLAY?"

[asteroid]

I'm off to round up stray shopping carts in the Safeway parking lot.

Do you get a completely random selection, or is it rigged?

I'm sure people gathering up shopping carts abide by city statutes to the same extent that Indian casinos abide by the regulations state gaming regulatory bodies set forth - I mean it's not just on paper or anything like that.

[tech58]

It's a fun conspiracy theory, but my understanding is that class 3 regulations don't just specify that cards have to be selected "randomly" or "using an RNG." They need to operate randomly with equal probability given to all cards selected, as with a shuffled deck of actual cards.

A Class III video poker machine has a Random Number Generator (RNG) software program that randomly selects cards from a 52 virtual deck (assuming no wild cards). When you press the deal button, the RNG selects five cards at random, which is the initial five cards that you see on your screen. The RNG continues to shuffle the remaining 47-card deck until you decide which cards you want to hold. When you hit the draw button, the shuffling stops and the replacement cards are selected from the top of the shuffled 47-cards deck.

By law, each card has to have the same probability of being selected on the deal and draw; therefore, the probability of selecting any card is the same as it would be if you randomly drew cards from a freshly shuffled deck of cards.

Going by this here:
http://tamburin.casinocitytimes.com/art ... ines-61886

If you have a better source, I'm all ears.

Excellant read on the Tamburin article. Thanks Eduardo.
Lots of good points and i have learned a lot. We have a wealth of talent to learn from. Thanks

I understand the laws and the way the RNG is supposed to operate to be legal.No questions.
And the machine manufacturer has no reason to produce illegal machines.
But i think we all understand that of the two important factors,pay-tables and true randomness of card selection, we can see one but not the other.

Therein lies the rub!
If, as our computer experts on this thread have testified,it is possible for a machine owner (casino) to alter the randomness of card selection it is most certainly not detectable by the best VP players.
Then this begs the question, who, if anyone, checks machines for randomness?

My understanding is that, Las Vegas for example, has a strong history of policing such things. Am i wrong on that?
Probably other states like NJ, Mississippi,Colorado, etc. with lots of regular casinos may have some inspection procedure.
But the tone of comments about Indian casinos seems to leave this area very murky!

I play regularly at an Indian casino As i stated before a plaque on there wall explicitly states that they are "NOT REGULATED BY THE STATE OF MICHIGAN', in caps just as quoted.But rather by the "Federal bureau of Indian affairs and other agencies"
Efforts by others to complain to the Feds was handled by directing them back to the casino.
Is any effort to find out who might possibly have the responsibility of verifying legality of machines dead ended at that point?

[asteroid]

I play regularly at an Indian casino As i stated before a plaque on there wall explicitly states that they are "NOT REGULATED BY THE STATE OF MICHIGAN', in caps just as quoted.But rather by the "Federal bureau of Indian affairs and other agencies"
Efforts by others to complain to the Feds was handled by directing them back to the casino.
Is any effort to find out who might possibly have the responsibility of verifying legality of machines dead ended at that point?

Are you familiar with the phrase "The fox is guarding the hen house" ?

[billryan]

Why do addicts buy unknown quality drugs from unknown street people?
Because they are addicts.
Why do people continue to play games they consider fixed?

[tech58]

I play regularly at an Indian casino As i stated before a plaque on there wall explicitly states that they are "NOT REGULATED BY THE STATE OF MICHIGAN', in caps just as quoted.But rather by the "Federal bureau of Indian affairs and other agencies"
Efforts by others to complain to the Feds was handled by directing them back to the casino.
Is any effort to find out who might possibly have the responsibility of verifying legality of machines dead ended at that point?

Are you familiar with the phrase "The fox is guarding the hen house" ?

In my post on 9/15 on this thread i asked the very question using chicken coop instead of hen house, looks like fox is the prevailing feeling.
I have no evidence nor rational feeling that any game i play is rigged. I am simply seeking to learn the truth about any possible verification process and who might be responsible to make it happen.

Still searching, at present "fox" is in the lead, anymore HELPFUL info would be appreciated.

[billryan]

I went to the diner and everyone was.complaining about the fish. So I tried it and.it seemed off. Still uncertain I ordered it again. This time I got deathly sick. I can't wait to feel better so I can go back for more fish.

[onemoretry]

I just can't resist this one. I'm off to a card game this afternoon that I absolutely know is totally rigged, but I'll play anyways - it's duplicate bridge where all the hands are predealt.

[advantage playe]

I always preferred pinochle !!

[Imgary]

Bumping this older thread as over the years I’ve experienced a huge difference between playing older machines and the newer ones.

At NYNY all of their VP is dated. I’ve gotten numerous 4 Aces with a kicker even though their machines have terrible 7/5 paytables. At other casinos with the newer machines I win nothing. These machines mind you have paytables going up to 10/6 for DDB.

The simple answer to this which has already been given is because of server based gaming. The randomness is being handled via a server and not the EPROM chip.

A few other notes:

Anyone who thinks the Nevada Gaming commission is going in and inspecting VP is clueless. I’ve had several interactions with them and they ALWAYS side with the casino.

Why is it that every older machine I play with lousy paytables I get substantial play through? Am I just lucky on older machines?

VP has been rigged in the past. A company called American Coin had a programmer who rigged the EPROM to allow for less Royal Flushes on video poker machines. He was going to testify and was murdered. https://news3lv.com/features/video-vaul ... es-part-ii

Let’s face it no one wants to think the games they are playing are rigged. I surely don’t. However sometimes one must face reality.

[billryan]

I've had two interactions with the NCC, both decided in my favor. Neither involved video poker,though