No more FPDW anywhere!

[applepear86]

Are we supposed to feel any sympathy for casinos? Because I don't. Glad they got screwed during covid.

Karl is right though, they're obviously greedy and anti-consumer. Especially in regional markets. And as the wall street casino cartels consolidate property ownership, so are the formerly competitive casino resort markets like LV.

The casinos didn't do anything to deserve it. Forcibly shutting down a business is akin to imprisoning an individual. (Which was also done, via lockdowns.)

What else is different about regional markets that could explain the apparent greed? How about tax rates? 50% in some markets, compared to around 10% in Nevada iirc. The greediest players in the game are the politicians and voters.

If you want pro-consumer conditions, you need the freest markets possible. Many regional markets have caps on licenses, and big political payoffs are required to obtain one. Even Vegas has major barriers to entry.

It doesn't make sense to claim that an entire industry is enjoying irresponsible greed, and yet no other operators invade to capture some of the profits. It suggests a flawed analysis.

Casino stocks have been poor performers. There's a gaming ETF, ticker symbol BJK. Since 2008 inception, total return is +40%. S&P 500 same period is +430%.

Awww those poor casinos. I'll get my little violin out and play it for them.

I do agree though that it should be deregulated. All those cartels, whether tribal or wall street, would collapse if there was absolutely no licensing and someone could throw some machines up in a strip mall anywhere in the country.

[dinghy]

Awww those poor casinos. I'll get my little violin out and play it for them.

Oh that's nice, are you musical? I've never developed any aptitude.

In tribute to your emoji, here's 11-year-old Joshua Tan playing "My Will Go On" from Titanic:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WQ64G7AkYc8

I hate that song .

[FAA]

So much consumer choice in AC. An embarrassment of riches in selecting who impoverishes us. Blessed, I guess.

[Karl_EDT]

What is much more complicated to calculate is when you should hold a single eight. Often the singleton 8 is preferable to a singleton high card Q or K, and once in a great while preferable to a singleton J.

You need a bunch of wheel hits to keep your head above water and away from the shark in this game.

Yes thanks New2vp, your comments are appreciated, and specifically you touched on the thing that kinda jumped out at me when I attempted to think deeply on the strategy and holdings of this game, what to do with with one or two 8s in the deal when surrounded by other cards that usually are held. I'm not sure how much effort I want to expend learning this game if I'm never really going to play it seriously, but it's just one of those things that spark your curiosity and unintentionally get you to sink lots of time playing!
I did not get as far as you have in figuring out the nuances, especially with DDB versus TDB, or other possible games.

Does anyone recall a similar game involving 7s as the special card instead of 8s? I just tried searching for such a game, I cannot recall the specific title but around 2012 or so I seem to remember encountering a "Lucky 7s" video poker (not the commonplace slots games that feature some theme of lucky 7s. I could be completely mistaken, or maybe it was a different card or number? I know vegas casinos used to have promotional games or features of things like "Card of the day" or even Hand of the day. If you are a Game of Thrones fan, imagine the Hand of the day being four Kings lol

I read somewhere a term that was coined "Slotify" or "Slotification", which apparently describes taking normal Videopoker games and hybridizing them to incorporate other games, typically slots, by adding some random non-strategic element to the game flow, such as these wheels. Scratcher or Scratch off elements also come to mind in VP games like Ultimate 4 of a king where you are given a screen that resembles a scratcher lottery ticket and you pick squares to win various amounts. I actually like these games because they can be more entertaining than usual, so long as it is not a one sided affair that takes my money much faster than normal.

[dinghy]

So much consumer choice in AC.

I wouldn't want to live anywhere near that hellhole, but I have to commend the state of New Jersey for some pro-choice policy changes. NJ was possibly the first state to legalize online casinos (c. 2013), and one of the first to allow sports betting.

To the perpetual complainers who hate b&m conditions, you have available a very simple remedy which is to play online instead. (You do have to be in a legalized state though.)

Addressing some of the specific complaints, playing online you never have to pay to park. Minimum bets are (in general) exceptionally reasonable. I'll use Bally as my reference because it's first alphabetically. Bally has 10-cent, single-zero roulette. On some roulette games, they offer the la partage rule which reduces the house edge to 1.35%.

Blackjack pays 3:2.

I haven't found a slot game below 95%. One of the popular titles I see mentioned on forums is Invaders from the Planet Moolah. It's 96% at Bally. And one game returns 98%.

Video poker is full-pay. I see 99.72% NSUD, and at other sites I've seen Ultimate X a little higher than that. Haven't seen anything above 100%.

Online operators are the same companies that run the b&m's. How can they be so "greedy" in one context, and generous in another? Maybe the circumstances are different. Bally offers this explanation:

[TripleTriple]

It's not a "hellhole". And a lot of the gamblers are not among the worst people.

And I call BS on the statement regarding maintenance of machines. Yes, it's different. It's definitely more the overhead and comps associated with drawing/keeping players into the physical venue...dont be so naive to think online operations are not greedy. It's all what the market will bear and what competition exists.

[New2vp]

Does anyone recall a similar game involving 7s as the special card instead of 8s? I just tried searching for such a game, I cannot recall the specific title but around 2012 or so I seem to remember encountering a "Lucky 7s" video poker (not the commonplace slots games that feature some theme of lucky 7s.

Search this forum using the term "Shamrock Sevens". It was discussed here in 200"7".

[dinghy]

It's not a "hellhole".

Fair. That's not the exact word I had in mind, but I was trying to keep it PG.

And a lot of the gamblers are not among the worst people.

The mosquito I tried to kill yesterday had more self-respect than most gamblers.

dont be so naive to think online operations are not greedy. It's all what the market will bear and what competition exists.

That wasn't the point I was going for. Greed accusations are largely irrelevant. Let's argue about something that matters. I'm beginning to doubt that the Walmart greeter sincerely wanted me to have a nice day. Something must be done about it!

And I call BS on the statement regarding maintenance of machines.

It's a cost. I think they could have also mentioned acquisition costs. Sometimes I listen to industry podcasts, and they think it's a big issue. Today's slot machines are big and elaborate. They're so expensive that casinos are reluctant to buy them outright. About a year ago, the Las Vegas Advisor replied to a question:

"The lease idea goes back to the first Megabucks wide-area progressive machines, in which the casinos and slot manufacturers shared in the profits earned from the networked machines, as well as the liability of paying out the big jackpots.

"That evolved to encompass slots with lower jackpots, but expensive themes. Licensing costs for hot intellectual-property machine themes, starting with Wheel of Fortune, continue to go higher and higher. The cost of the machines themselves, plus the amortized licensing fees, would catapult the price to buy them out of reach of most casinos. So those slots are now leased by the casinos from the manufacturer-owners."

Costs are higher, and the games have shorter lifespans.

If we try to look at it objectively, it appears to me the industry has shifted toward games that are more fun and exciting -- but also tighter. It's more of a straight entertainment model, like a theme park. Personally it's not my cup of tea ride, but it has an audience.

[olds442jetaway]

I will never play a machine where I can’t see the paytable. Unless it’s 5 bucks to kill time for some odd reason.