Playing Video Poker in the Swamp

[Vman96]

Given the same paytable, and assuming the proper execution of the Seminole's Gaming Compact with the state of Florida, I think you're pissing potential money away by betting 1 coin at $5 vs. 5 coins at $1, but I think you knew I thought that.

I don't think you've claimed to hit a min coin Royal yet since you have tried this (I might be wrong on that though), but I think you have hit some max coin Royals? If so that helps the results of this method significantly. I also feel like you're generally hitting some of your biggest non-Royal hands with the most money on the line too from what I can read. Much easier to win if that happens frequently enough. As for myself, I'm still waiting on a Royal that's higher than at the 2-cent level.

I'm glad it's been working well for you so far though. Good luck has a significant effect in overall results even over many, many hands.

Speaking of...have any rough idea how many hands you have played since you started this betting pattern? Are you at 6 digits of total hand count even yet? Rough breakdown of max play vs. min play? (50/50? 70/30? etc.) And how many royals (max vs. min), AWAK (max vs. min), 4 Deuces (max vs. min), etc?   

[FloridaPhil]

I've been playing this way for about a year now. I've calculated my speed many times and I play about 1000 hands an hour. I play about 5 hours per week plus vacations and road trips. Conservatively, I have played about 350K hands since I started. I play mostly single line deuces wild, so that's a little more than 7 royal cycles. I've hit three max coin royals so far, two for $1000 and one for $4,000.  I've also hit some $62.50 royals and a few for $250. Actually, the majority of my good wins don't come from royals; they come from hitting max coin dollar quad deuces for $1,000.  I've hit one of these about once a month.  If you go to the contact page of my website www.cheapvideopoker.com you can see photos of some of these hits.
I've analyzed this and I think the reason is when you have a $250 daily budget and play single coin progessive quarters you frequently have a small profit after 4-5 hours of play. When that happens, I play single coin progessive dollars with the same system.   It is much more common to hit a max coin quad deuce than a royal.  A single coin dollar quad deuce pays the same as a max coin quarter royal, so there you have it.  My bankroll has been steadily growing this year and I've started taking shots at the $5 level. So far, the most I've taken $20 to has been $600, but one day I'm going to hit a max coin $5 quad deuce for $5K or a Royal for $20K and life will be good.  I have no doubt this will happen, it's only a matter of time.  I keep telling myself this strategy is bunk and I've just been lucky.  Maybe so, but it works and I'm sticking to it...
 
 
 
 

[BillyJoe]

Phil, I think it is great that your strategy has produced good results for you. The reality is, though, that over a long enough time, the mathematics will catch up with you, with dry spells at your max coin level, and missed opportunities at your lower coin level.

My view of VP is to 'position for success'. I feel there is a limited number of good or great hands that any VP game will yield. You have to be in the correct place, with the correct bet, when a bonus hand appears. I have had two dealt RFs playing DoublePay (aka DealDraw), both times playing max bet at the $1 level. It's an expensive game to play, but that 60k credit for the dealt RF at max coin was sweet.

All that said, I wish you continued luck with your approach.

[FloridaPhil]

Thanks for the encouragement. Think about this "How many single coin quarter losing hands days does it take to erase a $1,000 quad deuce or a max coin royal?"
 
The problem I have with traditional strategy is the huge losses you have to stomach in order to get to the good wins. I played this way for years and over time I never caught up and always ended the year in the negative. I hated myself, the game and everyone around me when I would lose $3,000 in one weekend.  No amount of royals is worth that pain. 
 
If you play 500,000 max coin hands a year with perfect play on a 97% machine, you will lose a bunch of money.  I've had $14,000 days but I always gave it back.  Unless you play 100% machines exclusively, have an unlimited budget and some luck on your side you will lose more money the more you play.  I may lose eventually, but my losses will be peanuts.  What it comes down to is playing the way you enjoy most.   I'm not saying my strategy will make you a long term winner. I'm saying you will probably enjoy the ride more and most likely have more money at the end of the year.  If more video poker players actually knew how much money they were paying to play, they would either give up the game or come up with something better.  I know exactly what I win and lose and the numbers before I switched were shocking.  I don't work for a casino, sell video poker software or care if anyone uses my strategy. I'm just putting it out there for someone who's tired of losing to consider. 
 

[case]

Phil, two posts back you said
"A single coin dollar quad deuce pays the same as a max coin quarter royal"

What game are you playing that quad deuces pays 1000 for 1 coin?

[Vman96]

Phil, two posts back you said
"A single coin dollar quad deuce pays the same as a max coin quarter royal"

What game are you playing that quad deuces pays 1000 for 1 coin?

He was stretching a little...

When playing 1 coin:

Royal: 250 coins
4 Deuces: 200 coins

They are pretty close.

[FloridaPhil]

Actually you are missing the whole point of my strategy. It's all outlined on my website.  If you read through the Strategy page, you will understand how it actually works.  I am not advocating playing one coin all the time.   I'm averaging about one $1,000 quad deuce a month.  I hit a $4,000 Royal doing this last spring which put me up a bunch and started my current run.  I limit my play to about $300 a day.  So far this year I'm still up a little over $5K and believe me I'm happy about that. 
I believe the only way you can beat a negative expectation video poker machine is the hit max coin jackpots at a higher denomination than you normally play.  I played standard max coin startegy on negative expectation machines for years and lost an amazing amount of money.  When I switched to this strategy my bankroll went slowly up and stopped going steadily down.  When I do have a losing day, it only hits my backroll for $300 at the most and I come home with something left most of the time.  When you turn a $20 bill into a thousand dollar ticket playing single coin 80% of the time, your money lasts for a very long time.
My overall objective is not to make money long term, it's to play longer, have fun and stopping losing my shirt.  In that regard, it's a winner.

[wildman49]

Actually you are missing the whole point of my strategy. It's all outlined on my website.  If you read through the Strategy page, you will understand how it actually works.  I am not advocating playing one coin all the time.   I'm averaging about one $1,000 quad deuce a month.  I hit a $4,000 Royal doing this last spring which put me up a bunch and started my current run.  I limit my play to about $300 a day.  So far this year I'm still up a little over $5K and believe me I'm happy about that. 
I believe the only way you can beat a negative expectation video poker machine is the hit max coin jackpots at a higher denomination than you normally play.  I played standard max coin startegy on negative expectation machines for years and lost an amazing amount of money.  When I switched to this strategy my bankroll went slowly up and stopped going steadily down.  When I do have a losing day, it only hits my backroll for $300 at the most and I come home with something left most of the time.  When you turn a $20 bill into a thousand dollar ticket playing single coin 80% of the time, your money lasts for a very long time.
My overall objective is not to make money long term, it's to play longer, have fun and stopping losing my shirt.  In that regard, it's a winner.Took a trip with a buddy for some vp play  today. At lunch took him to the bar top and showed him the 1 coin play then max on 4 or more win. I been working with 1 coin for about 4 months on and off. Only been hitting 4 deuces on 1 coin many times. Love not taking them big losses with the system. Well anyway after getting my buddy playing the one coin after about 15 mins he holds 1 deuce on the max quarter and hits the other 3! He is hooked now! LOL. Before we left both of us playing 1 coin at $1 level. Held our own. Its a thrill to have shots at $1000 or even $4000 hits! Love the system playing it more and more. Thanks Phil!

[FloridaPhil]

Congratulations. I developed my Cheap Video Poker strategy so I could play longer on a limited budget and still have a chance at a decent jackpot.  The idea to switch to dollars at $25 came later.  I quickly realized this strategy would allow me to play at a higher denomination than I could afford to most of the time.  My bankroll is at a point now where I am experimenting with $5 machines and have found the results to be the same. It's not hurting my bankroll because I never wager more than $20 at a time. If you hit a $5 DW machine at the right time, you can roll up quite a profit.  Just be sure to cash out before the game goes back the other way by setting stop limits as you go. I also noticed that many of the good jackpots occur during the same sessions that allow me to move up in denomination. This doesn't always hold true but it does more than 50% of the time. Contrary to what people will tell you, it is possible with enough experience to take advantage of these wild card game streaks and cash in on them.  Whatever you think of my strategy, you will have to agree it does let your money last longer.  No everyone has the income to risk losing $10-20K or more a year in a slot machine.

[al66056]

do not know what i am doing