I play everyday

[FloridaPhil]

That's the default here. The idea isn't to empty your IRA, it's to grow it.

Gambling in a casino is not a way to grow anything but a callus on your butt. I was asked to help someone who did what you suggest. She went through $200K of her deceased husband's life insurance money. If you would like to reimburse her for trying to duplicate Mr. Dancer's results, I'll set up a GoFundMe account. Let's see how many APs contribute.

[FloridaPhil]

I have no issue with those who choose "beating the casino" as a career choice. It's their money and they should know the risks. What I object to is the assumption that there is a math based fool proof strategy that produces this result. Gambling involves risk. So does investing for profit. The government forces us to print disclaimers warning investors that past results do not guarantee future profits. This disclaimer should apply to video poker as well.

[Jstark]

Of course they know the risks. That's why they learn everything that is pertinent to that endeavor whether it's VP, card counting at blackjack, etc.

[Tedlark]

That's the default here. The idea isn't to empty your IRA, it's to grow it.

Gambling in a casino is not a way to grow anything but a callus on your butt. I was asked to help someone who did what you suggest. She went through $200K of her deceased husband's life insurance money. If you would like to reimburse her for trying to duplicate Mr. Dancer's results, I'll set up a GoFundMe account. Let's see how many APs contribute.

How did YOU help this woman Phil? Did you counsel her on the risks and evils of gambling, while in the meantime telling her how you go to casinos once or more a week but you only play small with money that you can afford to lose? Did you tell her that Bob Dancer, not HER, was to blame for her plight?

I am officially nominating you for citizen of the year.

[FloridaPhil]

Of course they know the risks. That's why they learn everything that is pertinent to that endeavor whether it's VP, card counting at blackjack, etc.

Absolutely. Same with investors. The problem comes when you sell a fool proof investment strategy. If you make that claim, the government will shut you down. No such rule applies to gambling. You can make any claims you want, never provide any proof to back it up and use yourself as a testimonial. When your customer's complain, you say they aren't skilled or intelligent enough. If they complain loud enough, you attempt to have them silenced. You can avoid all this if you admit that "chance" affects individual gambling results.

[paco13]

I hate monkey butt but if I could make 200k/yr for sure I'd deal with it. There's a powder for that.

[billryan]

At this point, I honestly no longer know if Phil is a guy with a personal grudge or is simply too dumb to understand what it obvious to everyone else. Either way any usefulness he might once have possessed here has long since past its expiration date.

[FloridaPhil]

I hate monkey butt but if I could make 200k/yr for sure I'd deal with it. There's a powder for that.

I have the financial ability to play VP at Bob Dancer's level. I stick with quarters because I know there are risks involved that I can not control. That risk involves the random selections of a computer chip. Nothing I can do will affect the numbers that chip may select while I am in front of the machines. When I invest in a stock or bond, I have the ability to research that investment before I lay out my money. Companies have track records, the good ones have superior management and the ability to pay me back even if the intended use of the money fails.

Ask yourself this question, "Is video poker gambling on a slot machine or investing in a CD?" You either accept the risk as part of the game or you blindly believe you can beat the casino with math. Those of you who fall into the second category do so because you want to believe it's true. I don't, so I enjoy the game as entertainment. Professional gamblers like Bob Dancer are "risk takers" not workers who exchange their labor for cash. They can fail just like one of my investments can fail. It's all in how much risk you are willing to accept.

[billryan]

Having the financial means is one leg of the stool, by far the easiest to attain.
Having the knowledge is the second step. As Phil shows, not everyone is capable of grasping the fine points of " the maths". Lastly, a successful AP believes in himself and has the balls to
bet on himself. Taking baby steps is cool, but try crossing a deep chasm using them.

[Eduardo]

Phil, the only reason you can blame Bob Dancer for "not saying" these things is because you completely ignore every time it happens. Read this post.

Bob Dancer often writes about losing at video poker. It is a reality that not only might happen, it absolutely WILL happen. The question is, what is losing. Losing your bankroll for a day? Losing over a year? You can always lose everything you put into a machine. But is that the end of your money forever? Let's hope not!

He talks about people in the situation of your lady friend and why they should not risk it all. Are you risking losing all your money in your bank account and not having another source of income? You should not have been playing in that situation. Losing your entire retirement with no other source of retirement income? You should not have been playing in that situation. He talks about these risks.

Some excerpts from an article Bob Dancer wrote on bankrolls here:
https://www.lasvegasadvisor.com/gamblin ... l-concern/

Paul commented that he was a quarter player and had lost half his bankroll in the past few months because he hadn’t hit a royal flush since October. So he was laying off playing for a while. He would add to his gambling bankroll from his job revenue and when he built it up again, he would go out and start playing some more.

My first thought was that if he could lose half of his bankroll in a couple months of part-time play (he has a full-time job and a wife/girlfriend that he brought to class once), then he was WAY over-betting his bankroll.

Later, I remembered that my primary reference is with regards to gambling as a profession. In my world, there is no safety net. You need to bet small enough so that 99% of the time (this is a parameter that can be set by you and different people have different risk tolerances) you will have enough bankroll to survive whatever swings come your way. Playing for stakes that could result in going broke in three months would scare the hell out of me. No thank you! (Personally, as a 69-year-old man with my best earning years behind, I’d want a 99.99% chance of not going broke — at least. This is only somewhat offset by additional income coming from various sources.)

Paul’s point of reference is that he has a full-time job and that this steady income source is a big safety net. He might well figure that he has enough bankroll to handle the normal swings 40% – 50% of the time and if he’s on the wrong side of that, he’ll take six months off from gambling while he replenishes his bankroll.

That might be an okay approach if you’re really disciplined. Can you really stay out of casinos for six months? Many players could not do that. They would keep playing until broke — often going into debt or selling valuable assets to support their habit. Not good.

It’s possible Paul doesn’t have a really good idea of how much bankroll is required to play a given game. Although software is available to help figure this out, many people don’t bother going through the exercise. They just play and hope they don’t run out of money. So long as you have a source of income that will replenish what you have, this isn’t a terrible way to go.

At the same time, “hope” isn’t a strategy. And many people don’t have a strong source of income that will keep them in the game even if they run out. Let me go through the exercise of figuring out how often Paul would go broke playing this South Point promotion all month.

...LOTS OF MATH HERE...

The chart shows he’d go bankrupt 21.24% of the time

You also need to get an idea of how devastated you would be if you lost your entire bankroll.

So, he clearly talks extensively about the risks and the risks of going completely BANKRUPT in situations.

Now stop accusing Bob Dancer of never stating the risks.