My mistake

[pokeherguy]

Sorry Webman didn't know I was doing anything wrong but when I saw it was about slots I didn't feel it was the right place and I didn't want to mislead anyone. Agter reading the other post MikeA best answered any question I might have ever had. I need to learn more about random and take whatever comes. I keep forgetting than we all can't be winners.

[EDC1977]

Pokeherguy: making slot references on a VP site won't get you alienated as quite a few here play slots also. It's just VP gives you the opportunity to control your outcome over a slot machine. You won't be disrespected or made fun of because you chose an alternate source of casino entertainment. It's your bankroll and you enjoy it however you wish. Slots, Keno and table games of various sorts help keep the casino doors open. I happen to enjoy a few table games along with some slots, not just VP constantly.

[Webman]

Pokerherguy, you weren't doing anything wrong. I just sent you a PM, let me know if you got it.

[faygo]

pokerherguy, most of the big winnings that have found there way into this household have been from the wife's slot play.   When I factor in the increased Cashback and Comps she gets over my VP play, the difference is negible.
 
The thing about VP is that one feels he has some control over his destiny. In that vein, I found a quote the other day from Louis Pasteur that might fit here. "Chance favors the prepared mind." 
 
 

[oej719]

Pasteur? He some kind of VP dude?

[pokeherguy]

 
{Here's a link to the state gaming regs in AK, regarding electronic gaming systems:
 
http://www.arkansas.gov/dfa/field_audit ... egs24.html
 
There's a lot of specs in there that don't have anything to do with randomness.  Here are the relevant sections.  Section (i) is a key one, stating that odds in VP have to be the same as those you'd see if you were playing it at a table with a dealer.
 
24.35 Randomness Requirements
Where the authorized game or system uses a Random Number Generator (RNG) to make selections, such RNG and the selections shall:

(a) Be statistically independent;
(b) Conform to the desired random distribution;
(c) Pass various recognized statistical tests;
(d) Be unpredictable;

(e) Be cycled continuously in the background between games and during game play at a speed that cannot be timed by the player. It is understood that at some time during the game, the RNG may not be cycled when interrupts may be suspended however, this exception shall be kept to a minimum;

(i) Unless otherwise denoted on the payglass, where the EGS plays a game that is recognizable such as Poker, Blackjack, etc., the same probabilities associated with the live game shall be evident in the simulated game. For example, the odds of drawing a specific card or cards in Poker shall be the same in the live game as if a physical deck of cards were being used. Card games also must meet the following:

(k) Each possible permutation or combination of game elements that produces winning or losing game outcomes shall be available for random selection at the initiation of each play, unless otherwise denoted by the game;

 (m) All Combinations and Outcomes Shall Be Available. Each possible permutation or combination of game elements that produces winning or losing game outcomes shall be available for random selection at the initiation of each play, unless otherwise denoted by the game rules;
******************
You really can go through some amazing good/bad streaks in VP on any device operating randomly (an actual VP machine, VP program on PC, VP on handheld device). }
 
Thanks to cddenver for answering any question about the games. When I actually took the time his post it did the job for me. I need to quit thinking so much and accept random for what it is. Seeing as how I was doing so well over the years it is probably time for the numbers to catch up with me.

[pokeherguy]

Speaking of random, we were working in the shop monday and we could see some bad clouds to our south so we started to get everything inside and just barely made it. We got some strong winds and a lot of rain that lasted maybe 3 minutes. The power went off and we expected it would come on in a few minutes but found out the storm had been a little more powerfull than we knew and it stayed off until the next day. Just down the street a guy was working in his shop and lost everything he had in there. Pretty much the only place that got destroyed he was able to get under a car he was working on.

[MikeA]

Arkansas, Texas, Oklahoma, Nebraska, Missouri, Iowa and Kansas....yep, we feel your pain Pokeherguy.  It's been a very tough Spring.  Seems like we have two types of weather...Rainy or Windy and sometimes both at the same time!Were the winds that hit your town straight-line or was it a tornado?

[cddenver]

Sorry Webman didn't know I was doing anything wrong but when I saw it was about slots I didn't feel it was the right place and I didn't want to mislead anyone. Agter reading the other post MikeA best answered any question I might have ever had. I need to learn more about random and take whatever comes. I keep forgetting than we all can't be winners.
 
In most of the threads here we seem to start in one place and end up in another, so don't worry about it.  If we chastised people for wandering around in their posts there wouldn't be too many of us left here.  Keep them coming, sir.
 
As far as randomness goes I take the simple view.  While I don't KNOW how things are done, my reasoning is:
 
Casinos have a good thing going with negative return games on machines operating randomly.  Why mess around with that in terms of special coding that might introduce patterns (predictablity)?  If they want to make more money, they can simply use the legal alternative - lower the paytables.
 
As far as quads in general go, at a down-and-dirty level you see an unusual distribution of them over time that's due solely to the different combinations of cards that can be dealt/drawn from a deck.  The average in JoB games is roughly every 400 hands for a quad, but that doesn't mean that half occur in fewer hands and half in more hands.  About 2/3 of them come up in fewer hands, but that 1/3 that take longer (sometimes WAY longer) put the average at 400 hands.  It's that funky distribution that gives us those good and bad runs that we all know and love.
 
For many years I used to wonder about the same things you do - "how is the casino jacking me over?".  Once I began keeping detailed records of how often I was hitting RF's, Aces, kickers, bonus quads, etc., I could see that longer-term (100K's of hands) what I was hitting is very close to what the theoretical values should be.  So nowadays I just don't worry about it.
 

[cddenver]

Pasteur? He some kind of VP dude?
 
Utility infielder for the Mets, 1986-90.  Drank some bad milk one day and had to retire.  I think.