SLS Casino opens this weekend.

[BillyJoe]

Regarding this casino,

I have read Bob Dancer's weekly column on Las Vegas Advisor today as well as hearing Gambling with an Edge Radio show episode last week in regards to big changes to the VP games due to Dancer winning $100,000 RF on a high denomination machine.

Anyone knows what changed and was it because this place was exploited by advantage players?
Sounds a little 'self-serving' on Dancer's part to me.

The fact is, you can be playing a 6/5 VP game for a high denomination, like $25, and if you get an RF, you will win the exact same amount. The VP pay tables have no effect on the payout of an RF (4000 credits) on any of the VP games that I have seen.

Now, a positive paytable may allow you to play a little longer on a given bankroll, assuming that you hit some flushes and full houses, which is where most of the pay table changes exist. Beyond that - blind luck always works.    

AND - I just read where the SLS Buffet is closing, to reopen after the first of the year. I wonder if Bob is looking for credit for that, too ?

[Vman96]

As far as the best paytables offered on those machines...It used to be NSUD (99.73%) and the players' club offers 0.2% comps. Maybe Bob thought it was a positive play with mailers lumped in, but definitely ridiculously risky. And unless I am missing something, it's doubtful the game was very positive after comps. Something that I would think any machine pro would consider a "big gamble". Unless there is something more to the story of course...

As for the Royal payout changing, it is generally 800 for 1 for max bets on most games, but there a few exceptions including 940/18/7 Kings or Better Joker Poker that gives 940 for 1 for the Royal (99.29%) vs. its 800/18/7 counterpart (98.94%). Another example I played for grinding points at Fitz Tunica for the Wii Bowling Tourney last month, 500/9/6 Jacks (98.88%). The VPFree2 faithful really despise that last one...

[alpax]

Unfortunately on my part, I left out too much important details.

The article has 2 parts, the 2nd part is to be continued for next Tuesday.

Bob played VP during the opening weekend of the casino. A day before Bob played, someone hit 4 Aces with Any 2/3/4 on $100 DDB. He got $2500 in free play, not much details provided there.

The game he played was 40/10/6 DDB at $25 or $100 denomination which is about 99.96% ER, the other choice he had was 8/5 Super Aces at 99.94% ER. These paytables were available at 25c or $25/$100, nothing in between.

The slot club is at 0.2% cashback.

Once he hit $100k Royal Flush, the machines were yanked from the casino, when Bob mentioned this, his co-host Richard Munchkin (well known advantage player) was upset.

With that in mind, not that I had immediate plans to go to SLS I was just curious, I went to VPFree2 and noticed 40/10/6 DDB is still available at quarters. The specialty games are reduced to 0.067% cashback ($15 coin in per credit, 100 credit = $1).

I might as well wait to see the 2nd part of the article, I suppose what I was wondering about the last post that should have phrased it better, is this the latest exploit that Dancer has capitalized on and ruined the opportunity for other advantage players?

[Vman96]

Well, if that's how it happened, then whoever hits the first Royal probably ruins the game regardless. $100k Royals are always going to be scrutinized. And playing at the 25c level is worthless to people trying to "make a living" off VP.

But I guess if people at SLS know who Bob is it would have set off a bigger flag. But I'm not even sure if casino brass would really know who he was.

And when I went in September, 40/10/6 DDB was still there for low-rollers. It resulted in the g/f's biggest win of the trip.



On my Feb. trip, I found this at Gustav's Bar at Paris of all places on one unit only...my g/f actually stumbled across it...unfortunately I only had one evening to play it.



It also offered full points. And it played up to the $5 level. It was an obvious error.

I didn't clearly state where it was in my Feb. TR, or tell VPFree2 because I was a bit greedy and was hoping it slide under the radar til I got back to Vegas. I knew if I reported to VPFree2, it surely wouldn't last much more than a week. A few months later a guy PMed me about it and I told him where it was because I knew he wouldn't blow it out of the water. It was still there at the time. But 7 months was too long of a wait. They eventually fixed the glitch. Probably thanks to an uptick of $20k Royals on it.

But at least I won over $100 probably the only time in my life that I will play a 100%+ bartop on the Strip. It would have been nicer if that 4 to a Royal came in though...lol

[onemoretry]

But I guess if people at SLS know who Bob is it would have set off a bigger flag. But I'm not even sure if casino brass would really know who he was.

I believe he stated in his article that they did, indeed, know him.

[Rebus]

Here's a link to Bob Dancer's article about playing at SLS in case anyone wants to read it.

Part One:

http://www.lasvegasadvisor.com/bob_dancer/2014/1111.cfm

[Rebus]

Another example I played for grinding points at Fitz Tunica for the Wii Bowling Tourney last month, 500/9/6 Jacks (98.88%). The VPFree2 faithful really despise that last one... I've played a lot worse than 98.88% with juicy promos, multipliers and/or bounceback. I guess that makes me NOT one of the vpFREE2 faithful. LOL!

[BillyJoe]

Unfortunately on my part, I left out too much important details.

The article has 2 parts, the 2nd part is to be continued for next Tuesday.

Bob played VP during the opening weekend of the casino. A day before Bob played, someone hit 4 Aces with Any 2/3/4 on $100 DDB. He got $2500 in free play, not much details provided there.

The game he played was 40/10/6 DDB at $25 or $100 denomination which is about 99.96% ER, the other choice he had was 8/5 Super Aces at 99.94% ER. These paytables were available at 25c or $25/$100, nothing in between.

The slot club is at 0.2% cashback.

Once he hit $100k Royal Flush, the machines were yanked from the casino, when Bob mentioned this, his co-host Richard Munchkin (well known advantage player) was upset.

With that in mind, not that I had immediate plans to go to SLS I was just curious, I went to VPFree2 and noticed 40/10/6 DDB is still available at quarters. The specialty games are reduced to 0.067% cashback ($15 coin in per credit, 100 credit = $1).

I might as well wait to see the 2nd part of the article, I suppose what I was wondering about the last post that should have phrased it better, is this the latest exploit that Dancer has capitalized on and ruined the opportunity for other advantage players?
Well, I guess, in that case, the BETTER approach would be to 'ban' Mr. Dancer from playing there, since he is obviously too talented a player for their VP pay table strategy. But, once again, hitting an RF could have happened to ANYONE playing at that level - advantage player or not. Did the casino expect to NEVER pay an RF ?

Assuming that there was a pay table strategy to attract more VP players, I do not see how 'yanking their machines' fits into it. Could it be that the machines were simply removed from the floor to allow NGC and IGT to check them for tampering? This routinely happens when a large jackpot is hit.    

[alpax]

It also offered full points. And it played up to the $5 level. It was an obvious error.

I didn't clearly state where it was in my Feb. TR, or tell VPFree2 because I was a bit greedy and was hoping it slide under the radar til I got back to Vegas. I knew if I reported to VPFree2, it surely wouldn't last much more than a week. A few months later a guy PMed me about it and I told him where it was because I knew he wouldn't blow it out of the water. It was still there at the time. But 7 months was too long of a wait. They eventually fixed the glitch. Probably thanks to an uptick of $20k Royals on it.

But at least I won over $100 probably the only time in my life that I will play a 100%+ bartop on the Strip. It would have been nicer if that 4 to a Royal came in though...lol

Awesome to hear that you were able to find an exploit at a strip casino as a non-Vegas resident. Reading stories about Caesar's Entertainment casinos being super stingy about their VP machines (evident by the lack luster games listed on VPFree2) makes the opportunity even more wonderful. Not many great quarter games on the strip as well. Hard to get full points on VP and they make you play Jacks or Better at $5 denom if you want the 9/6 paytable.

I would not tell people on VPFree either if I found such an opportunity, at least you guys got the good quads while you guys had the chance.

Thanks for sharing this story, the article did mention Bob knew the Director of Slots at SLS being a former employee of the Palms casino and they knew each other.

Still hard to explain that there was no 40/10/6 DDB for the denominations in between and at a such high denomination. It catered to both low and high rollers alike, I look forward to the second part of this article.

[alpax]

[QUOTE=alpax] Unfortunately on my part, I left out too much important details.

The article has 2 parts, the 2nd part is to be continued for next Tuesday.

Bob played VP during the opening weekend of the casino. A day before Bob played, someone hit 4 Aces with Any 2/3/4 on $100 DDB. He got $2500 in free play, not much details provided there.

The game he played was 40/10/6 DDB at $25 or $100 denomination which is about 99.96% ER, the other choice he had was 8/5 Super Aces at 99.94% ER. These paytables were available at 25c or $25/$100, nothing in between.

The slot club is at 0.2% cashback.

Once he hit $100k Royal Flush, the machines were yanked from the casino, when Bob mentioned this, his co-host Richard Munchkin (well known advantage player) was upset.

With that in mind, not that I had immediate plans to go to SLS I was just curious, I went to VPFree2 and noticed 40/10/6 DDB is still available at quarters. The specialty games are reduced to 0.067% cashback ($15 coin in per credit, 100 credit = $1).

I might as well wait to see the 2nd part of the article, I suppose what I was wondering about the last post that should have phrased it better, is this the latest exploit that Dancer has capitalized on and ruined the opportunity for other advantage players?
Well, I guess, in that case, the BETTER approach would be to 'ban' Mr. Dancer from playing there, since he is obviously too talented a player for their VP pay table strategy. But, once again, hitting an RF could have happened to ANYONE playing at that level - advantage player or not. Did the casino expect to NEVER pay an RF ?

Assuming that there was a pay table strategy to attract more VP players, I do not see how 'yanking their machines' fits into it. Could it be that the machines were simply removed from the floor to allow NGC and IGT to check them for tampering? This routinely happens when a large jackpot is hit.     [/QUOTE]

Nothing against Dancer, but the casino might have been too new to gather face recognition data to start banning people from entering. We will find out on the second part of the story their motive to remove the $25/$100 machines, not sure if the person before winning 200k from the $100 DDB also attributed to the decision.

Even at near positive expectation game, Dancer does mention a fair share of Full Houses and Flushes must be hit, but at 10 credits per full house, he gets a W2G for it.

It seems to be doubtful that the casino is inspecting the machines, SLS has been opened for 2 months now, VPFree has not listed those machines back on. So I do not think it is a malfunction.

I am interested to hear what the uproar is about.