HELLO BOB DANCER......

[DaBurglar]

  I answered your post with a long thoughtful reply. The more knowledgeable players recognized it as containing useful information and commented as such. I was/am not angry at you. Calling me "Blob" is rather juvenile. People who know me do not consider me a "miserable Pr*ck"I explained why I disagreed with you. I did not insult you, although I did say I didn't admire the way you thought about gambling. You may have wanted more from my answer than I was able to give, but I tried my best to respond to your questions. I was trying to teach you something, but some folks are un-teachable.You, on the other hand, responded with insults. Is that the way you normally treat people who are trying to have a civil conversation with you? Has that way of treating people worked well for you?FP accuses me of having this sneaky methodology of extracting money from people who want to learn video poker. I guess I do. It's called talking about the games accurately and telling people how to win.And it works if you apply it.The very first premise in my writing is always "if you don't have the advantage, don't play." You and FP keep insisting on ignoring that advice and claiming my "system" doesn't work. It is your discipline, not my methodology, that is flawed.I totally disagree with this.....you've totally lost sight of what my original point(s) were, and you are confusing and lumping me in with phil (not that I have anything against him but I do NOT follow his strategy at all....as I have stated MANY times, and what I thought was OBVIOUS to you when I asked my original questions/post, I always play max coins, the VAST VAST majority of my play in AC casinos has indeed been on the FEW 99% games/machines that exist in the city, I know PERFECT play for the games I play most often, and I NEVER EVER exceed my bankroll or play when I am sick, drunk or otherwise indisposed!  I am not a typical part time recreational loser, which is exactly why I finally asked you to specifically ADDRESS the fairly narrow and specific issue I raised!)I defy anyone to read your first response post to me and not come away with a decidedly negative, condescending and arrogant tone.....seriously, you must be the equivalent of "nose blind" to your attitude and how you come across in your posts....     But You know what, I do not even really care too much about that to be honest.....I have seen you many times before convey this "tone" of pseudo disdain and contempt for many people here....I was not surprised by it;  and honestly I only called you "blob" (which I have done many times before in what is just a silly game mocking your psuedo celebrity status here) after I got carried away in my post I made immediately following Phil's satirical post......I was just disappointed you failed to even touch upon the MAIN overriding issue of my post, that of HOW can I consistently see "Dud" rates far in excess of the expected 55% normal rate for a legit video poker machine......unless there truly is something "DIFFERENT" going on with AC video poker versus other markets.And I fail to see where you hid this "USEFUL Info" you referenced (and who amongst our knowledgeable posters here caught it???)   Seriously, If you read my original post, and then read your post in response.........wtf???  What useful info?   Nothing you posted was anything I previously did not know or realize on my own......however I did not need this following info (nor understood why you even felt the need to post it):[excerpt] Although I don't know why I would want play there
regularly. I prefer warm weather to cold. I prefer "West Coast
personalities" to "East Coast personalities." I prefer places where
there are lots of different opportunities for me to succeed at gambling.
I like the housing prices in Nevada compared to the prices in other
states. I like the tax structure in Nevada compared to those in other
states. Me moving near New Jersey isn't in the top 500 things I plan to
do with the rest of my life. [excerpt]       When did I ask you if you'd move out here?  Who cares about housing?  Or your top 500 things to do?   Hey, I used to live out there, I am fully aware of east coast/west coast differences, but what the hell does this have to do with my question/original post????   And again, there's that "tone" seeping into this.....this, rant.I have no idea who Frank Scoblete is, never heard of or met him, and I assure you it is NOT his words I am repeating......I am certain that Video Poker is regarded EXACTLY the same as other slots in AC because I have found this out on my own, through reading the actual NJ gaming regs (which are nebulously worded and unlike nevada do not clearly distinguish pure slots from games with "skill" like VP), and more important, talking with (by now) DOZENS of different casino executives, managers, slot techs and several people at the (now empty) Atlantic City office of Gaming enforcement located off the boardwalk.   If you honestly believe that it is just a matter of people "repeating something over and over" with respect to video poker being just another form of slots in AC, then you are entitled to your opinion/view, but I submit it is far more deep than that....I have over 6 years of data on AC video poker which indicates the DUD rate I am focused on is far in excess of the statistically NORMAL value of 55% that a expert like YOU would come to expect......taking into account variance, and randomness, I have found that many machines in many AC casinos consistently spit out rates in the high 60s and 70s......THIS IS WHY, EVEN THOUGH I ONLY PLAY 99% or better games in AC I have been unable to come close to breaking even!    This would explain, and it fits, AC having its video poker games regarded as "slots" because this is the only possible way to get a VP machine with a 99% paytable (like 8/5 Bonus poker) to return an average of 85-87% ....or literally ANYTHING lower than the 99% shown on the paytable.I was hoping BOB, you had some insight into this issue that previously no one has brought up....That's all I wanted.     Maybe you knew something or someone to either validate what I have found, or (equally desirable) perhaps you had some truly convincing evidence previously unknown or unrevealed, that what I am experiencing is just a extremely exceptional result, and that AC video poker operate the SAME as Vegas......

[Tedlark]

DaBurglar as Bob explained; he tried to best answer your question(s) in a form and manner comfortable to him. You did however cloud what you were attempting to ask by then adding to the climbing stack of questions that you were originally seeking answers to.

You have said that you read the New Jersey Gaming Regulations and if you have then you would know that video poker is judged differently than slots. Other people and not just myself have pointed this out to you in the past.

You have tried to say that video poker in Atlantic City is not the same as what is played in Nevada and you were, in fact, proved right on this. You were proved right when someone pointed out that machine returns for video poker are lower in the Nevada regulations as compared to the New Jersey regulations. So; they are not the same.

You got mad at Bob in much the same way you get mad at anyone else here who has a view you don't like: you call them names and talk down to them. Not that I would know how that feels from you.

You are in fact a recreational player as are 99 1/2% of the rest of us here. Bob Dancer does not have to post here and many appreciate it when he does. He is entitled to his opinions and he is also entitled to be critical of those who do not subscribe to getting the maximum benefit from their video poker play. If I buy a cake I expect to eat the entire cake and not let it go to waste. If I buy that same cake and only eat half of it and let the rest spoil I have lost money. If you play video poker in the same manner; you are wasting money.

The bottom line is that Bob did not validate your position so you, in typical fashion, lashed out at him.

The other bottom line is that you may just totally suck at video poker.

[DaBurglar]

Who knew ted had a man crush on Bob Dancer......???  I sure did not.....No seriously, you read and see what you want to see Ted, and it generally follows WHATEVER will allow you to make some desperate post to try and convince your "audience" (i.e.  the people you imagine actually care what you post about and towards ME and who you imagine, after reading your posts directed at me, all pump their fists at their computer screen and go "Way to go Ted!"  "boy you really told him that time") that you are "the man"......And As I pointed out in my previous post, Bob actually did not answer a goddamn thing, just took the opportunity to rant and practice his snotty posting skills....no wonder you love the guy.Seriously Ted, do you even bother to read the posts you claim to be responding to ,,,,,,you do this all the time, and here again is no exception:  you come up with some generalization or conclusion that defies all comprehension, leaving most of the "audience" scratching their heads going  "HUH??"    Wtf is this guy reading????    I knew you were delusional, but seriously, enough is enough,,,,,they have pharmaceuticals for all sorts of problems these days.....avail yourself of some.

[gregorio]

If what you guys are saying is true, than it's no wonder Atlantic City is in the dumper.   It wouldn't surprise me as everything that happens in Jersey seems to be rigged in some way.  I haven't played there in years and I don't intend to go back.   In all the places we have played, I have never seen anything that would lead me to think video poker machines are rigged.  What we have seen is a consistent pattern of reduced odds all across the country.  Personally, I'm boycotting any casino that doesn't offer a minimum of 98% games in quarters.  I'm sure they're shaking in their boots.  



Hi Phil. Don't you do a lot of VP playing at Hard Rock Hollywood? As far as I am concerned if ever there were "rigged" VP machines, HR Hollywood will be an undisputed champion among Vegas-style casino establishment. For my money they never actually "switched" from bingo-style machines. Only switched the word "bingo" to "Vegas" because it sounds much more legit. But like they say it's "Vegas-style", it aint no Vegas believe me. 

[alpax]

[QUOTE=FloridaPhil]



If what you guys are saying is true, than it's no wonder Atlantic City is in the dumper.   It wouldn't surprise me as everything that happens in Jersey seems to be rigged in some way.  I haven't played there in years and I don't intend to go back.   In all the places we have played, I have never seen anything that would lead me to think video poker machines are rigged.  What we have seen is a consistent pattern of reduced odds all across the country.  Personally, I'm boycotting any casino that doesn't offer a minimum of 98% games in quarters.  I'm sure they're shaking in their boots.  



Hi Phil. Don't you do a lot of VP playing at Hard Rock Hollywood? As far as I am concerned if ever there were "rigged" VP machines, HR Hollywood will be an undisputed champion among Vegas-style casino establishment. For my money they never actually "switched" from bingo-style machines. Only switched the word "bingo" to "Vegas" because it sounds much more legit. But like they say it's "Vegas-style", it aint no Vegas believe me.  [/QUOTE]

I believe HR Tampa is the closer one that Phil frequents. Either way the Seminole/Hard Rock jurisdiction seems to be one of the common ones where the 99% games are found at a minimum $1 denomination. Based on rumors I've seen, the comps/mailers are subpar compared to the average casino in the nation.

HR Hollywood is farther out and is requiring of a multiday stay. Over there if they have the 98.91% Airport/Illinois Deuces for quarters, Phil can play that at max bet and the theoretical losses can cover the hotel costs.

[FloridaPhil]

[quote=alpax]HR
Hollywood is farther out and is requiring of a multiday stay. Over
there if they have the 98.91% Airport/Illinois Deuces for quarters, Phil
can play that at max bet and the theoretical losses can cover the hotel
costs.[/quote]I play mostly at the Tampa Hard Rock where the quarter deuces schedule stinks.  The Hollywood Hard Rock has the better pay schedule so I play max coins.  I play max coins whenever I can find a pay schedule over 98%.  The cost to play is still there, but it's manageable.I'm just fed up with Bob Dancer's charade.  The idea that you can make 6 figures a year long term playing video poker is ridiculous and anyone who has played video poker for very long knows this too well.  There is a cost to play video poker and I chose to pay as little as possible.  Putting Bob Dancer on an alter and genuflecting  to the God of video poker is getting old in my book.  This whole thing reminds me of Milli-Vanilli...   If players want to believe his marketing, go for it.  I'm not fooled in the slightest and I think a lot of players are silently coming to the same conclusion. 

[case]

DaBurglarYou were the one who called Dancer out to make a reply. He told you in his opening remarks that he has not played there in a few years. He also said he knows of a few APs who play there and find advantage plays and do ok. The reason he stated about not wanting to live there ect was meant as he would rather live in Nevada BUT he would have no problem playing in AC as he trust the VP in AC BECAUSE he knows of a few players that do well there. So in retrospect he did answer your question best he could. He could just relay what he has heard from other advantage players who do in fact play in Atlantic city.I know this was not the answer you wanted from MR Dancer but he could only report what he knows.There is a big and I mean big divide on this site from posters who believe VP is rigged and those who believe the game has not changed just the pay tables and comps. Neither side is going to change their opinion and why should they? You played in AC for many years and you know what you have seen change over the years. No one is going to tell you different and again why should they? Those that play and have seen no difference in VP will tell you what they have found. Both sides do and will continue to disagree.It makes for interesting reading as both sides continue to butt heads on the honesty of VP in their jurisdiction. We should be able to disagree and still keep the argument civil.

[FAA]

I
play mostly at Tampa Hard Rock where the quarter deuces schedule
stinks. Hollywood Hard Rock has the better pay schedule so I play
max coins.  I play max coins whenever I can find a pay schedule over
98%. The cost to play is still there, but it's manageable.There is a
cost to play video poker and I chose to pay as little as possible.--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------Words to live/play by! I have full access to full pay, but I have losing days mostly due to bankroll limitations. Somebody in my situation should probably spend half at least their play time on min coin, without exception.

[FAA]

Case, thanks for being a voice of reason. You just said everything I intended to post. ^

[FloridaPhil]

[quote=case]It makes for interesting reading as both sides continue to butt heads on
the honesty of VP in their jurisdiction. We should be able to disagree
and still keep the argument civil.[/quote]I agree.  Everyone starts out believing that tales of video poker riches are true because it's part of the fun.  Eventually reality sets in and you become angry and start blaming yourself and the casinos.  To top it off, the person who is promoting these ideas responds by telling you that you are too stupid or not disciplined enough to duplicate his results.  My real problem with Bob Dancer is not is methodological, it's his attitude toward small players who buy his products and pay his bills.  Not all of us are as stupid and gullible as he seems to think.  I've said my peace and I'm done with this subject.  My wife and I are going to Cherokee next week and I'm looking forward to playing in the real world.